Reject of the Race - Brazil 2015

Post by **Miguel98** » 15 Nov 2015, 17:36

Post your nominations

Shizuka · Post by **Shizuka** » 15 Nov 2015, 17:41

The new Renault engine. Well done :facepalm:

WeirdKerr · Post by **WeirdKerr** » 15 Nov 2015, 17:45

Hamilton for almost forgetting not to spray the champagne this weekend....

golic_2004 · Post by **golic_2004** » 15 Nov 2015, 17:47

I have to give it to Carlos Sainz Jr. His nightmare weekend ended on lap 1 as the only retirement.

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 15 Nov 2015, 17:50

Shizuka wrote:The new Renault engine. Well done

This.

Alternatively, to stop this from being a total Renault blowout (though it certainly deserves to be, how can you make an upgraded engine that's even worse than the old one, not even Honda managed that

) - David Coulthard. Insipid, low-brow, and moronic commentary. Please for the love of god get rid of him, BBC.

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 15 Nov 2015, 17:56

Mercedes, for doing everything in their power to suck life and entertainment out of the sport. There was not one consideration at any point in the race to switch strategies for the second placed car. Their determination to secure 1-2 finishes at any cost renders any chance of real competition non-existent.

This is particularly frustrating for a number of reasons. The fact they're so far ahead of everyone else is one of these. There's no reason to be so protective. With the advantage they have, they can afford to experiment. At the end of the race in Mexico, I said the same thing - that the lack of risk-taking is just painful.

Perhaps this is why Rosberg has struggled more this year? By that I mean Lewis nailed qualifying so much in the first half of the year, he was able to lead and thus shut down the race in the same way Nico has been able to do at the last two.

What I want to see is the decision-making put back into the hands of the drivers. I felt that as soon as Lewis knew he couldn't pass on track that the race was a foregone conclusion. The team effectively ensured he was unable to challenge for the win. I want to see team radio banned, drivers pitting when they want and communication done only through pit boards. They do it in MotoGP, they can do it in F1.

So frustrating.

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 15 Nov 2015, 18:15

The new spec Renault engine is the stand-out candidate in my mind. So be it. A dishonourable mention to David Coulthard for what seemed like worse commentary than usual and also to Carlos Sainz, Jr.'s car for just not wanting to work.

Post by **Miguel98** » 15 Nov 2015, 18:39

Renault - Red Bull have the right to complain :facepalm:

.
Felipe Massa - Home race, and that was abysmal.. Having UBER HIGH tyre pressure surelly didn't help though..

But it has to be...

Mercedes - STOP PUTTING YOUR DRIVERS ON THE SAME BATHPLUGGING STRATEGY, MONACO WON'T HAPPEN AGAIN FFS

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 15 Nov 2015, 19:12

Man, if I was being totally honest in my ROTR nominations, the BBC commentary would be on it most weekends. I think I've complained so many times that I'm a broken record on the subject. So:

1. Carlos Sainz's car
2. ........um, I dunno, Nelson Piquet Jr.

James1978 · Post by **James1978** » 15 Nov 2015, 19:20

Agree with the noms for Mercedes - why was Bahrain 2014 such a hum-dinger despite their total domination there? Because Hamilton and Rosberg were on different compounds at different times. There's no excuse for them not to do that in Abu Dhabi now Rosberg has secured runner-up in the championship, they have absolutely nothing to lose now.

I actually snoozed off a couple of times during that race!

Izzyeviel · Post by **Izzyeviel** » 15 Nov 2015, 20:45

'Overspeed'

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 15 Nov 2015, 20:46

Izzyeviel wrote:'Overspeed'

'Tank slapper'

Post by **mario** » 15 Nov 2015, 21:10

James1978 wrote:Agree with the noms for Mercedes - why was Bahrain 2014 such a hum-dinger despite their total domination there? Because Hamilton and Rosberg were on different compounds at different times. There's no excuse for them not to do that in Abu Dhabi now Rosberg has secured runner-up in the championship, they have absolutely nothing to lose now.

I actually snoozed off a couple of times during that race!

Have Mercedes even allowed their drivers to use their tyres in a different sequence this year? It does seem to be the case that they are afraid even to allow that level of variation.

Although the way in which Sainz's car failed was pretty pathetic, I think that Williams may have a late nomination following Massa's disqualification - not only was it a silly way to be disqualified, it evidently didn't do Massa much good in the race either.

Fetzie · Post by **Fetzie** » 15 Nov 2015, 21:31

AndreaModa wrote:What I want to see is the decision-making put back into the hands of the drivers. I felt that as soon as Lewis knew he couldn't pass on track that the race was a foregone conclusion. The team effectively ensured he was unable to challenge for the win. I want to see team radio banned, drivers pitting when they want and communication done only through pit boards. They do it in MotoGP, they can do it in F1.

So frustrating.

Or maybe add 5 seconds to the driver's time for every transmission. Safety issues are broadcasted to all radios by race control/steward's office, and drivers can talk to race control "for free". The team can only contact a driver if the driver initiates the radio call. Pit-lane board can be freely used without penalty. The driver chooses when to pit and which tyres to take. If you're driving in F1 I'd expect you to know how to tell if you need a pit stop and how long the tyres have in them (isn't that what free practice is for?). Maybe they could give each driver three "free" communications.

WRT to the RotR:

How does an engine upgrade lead to a slower car?! Got to be Renault.

Honourable mention: Mercedes, for removing any chance of a fight for the win.
Honourable mention 2: Aerodynamics, for making it impossible to chase the leader.

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 15 Nov 2015, 21:35

Fetzie wrote:Honourable mention 2: Aerodynamics, for making it impossible to chase the leader.

Didn't seem to stop Mad Max or Ricciardo... maybe Hamilton just wasn't as good as Rosberg this weekend?

Fetzie · Post by **Fetzie** » 15 Nov 2015, 21:38

Salamander wrote:
Fetzie wrote:Honourable mention 2: Aerodynamics, for making it impossible to chase the leader.

Didn't seem to stop Mad Max or Ricciardo... maybe Hamilton just wasn't as good as Rosberg this weekend?

They weren't chasing people with the same engine as them though, were they? And they weren't challenging a driver who had clean air in front of them (and thus vastly more front downforce, so they didn't shred the front tyres).

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 15 Nov 2015, 21:41

Fetzie wrote:
Salamander wrote:
Fetzie wrote:Honourable mention 2: Aerodynamics, for making it impossible to chase the leader.

Didn't seem to stop Mad Max or Ricciardo... maybe Hamilton just wasn't as good as Rosberg this weekend?

They weren't chasing people with the same engine as them though, were they? And they weren't challenging a driver who had clean air in front of them (and thus vastly more front downforce, so they didn't shred the front tyres).

No, but they were chasing people with better engines than them

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 15 Nov 2015, 21:43

Simtek wrote:
Fetzie wrote:They weren't chasing people with the same engine as them though, were they? And they weren't challenging a driver who had clean air in front of them (and thus vastly more front downforce, so they didn't shred the front tyres).

No, but they were chasing people with better engines than them

And I'm pretty sure the cars ahead had fairly clean air in front of them.

EDIT: Perez certainly did the first time Verstappen passed him.

AustralianStig · Post by **AustralianStig** » 15 Nov 2015, 21:46

My nomination goes to hot rubber, for causing Massa's DSQ!

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 15 Nov 2015, 21:57

Salamander wrote:
Simtek wrote:
Fetzie wrote:They weren't chasing people with the same engine as them though, were they? And they weren't challenging a driver who had clean air in front of them (and thus vastly more front downforce, so they didn't shred the front tyres).

No, but they were chasing people with better engines than them

And I'm pretty sure the cars ahead had fairly clean air in front of them.

EDIT: Perez certainly did the first time Verstappen passed him.

Guys, whether or not Hamilton was better or worse than Rosberg on the day is irrelevant. As is the effect of aerodynamics or engine power. Turbulence when following another car has been a problem in F1 for decades.

The problem as far as I saw it today was control being taken from the driver and put into the hands of those on the pit wall. In the sense that we're no longer watching drivers race and be fully in control of everything they do. Hamilton, whether he was ultimately faster than Rosberg or not, wanted to try something different but was denied the possibility. I'd bet that anything he might have tried would have probably ended up unsuccessful, but again that's not the point. We weren't watching Rosberg and Hamilton racing today, we were watching a leading German car manufacturer lock down a race result that they believed would be beneficial to them without allowing their drivers any freedom to do what they want. That's not sport in my mind. It's an overly self concious company sucking the life out of sport.

Post by **Ataxia** » 15 Nov 2015, 22:08

AndreaModa wrote:The problem as far as I saw it today was control being taken from the driver and put into the hands of those on the pit wall. In the sense that we're no longer watching drivers race and be fully in control of everything they do. Hamilton, whether he was ultimately faster than Rosberg or not, wanted to try something different but was denied the possibility. I'd bet that anything he might have tried would have probably ended up unsuccessful, but again that's not the point. We weren't watching Rosberg and Hamilton racing today, we were watching a leading German car manufacturer lock down a race result that they believed would be beneficial to them without allowing their drivers any freedom to do what they want. That's not sport in my mind. It's an overly self concious company sucking the life out of sport.

Allow me to play devil's advocate here for a second, because I have a question; from Mercedes' perspective, why risk it? They had an objective here, which was to get Nico 2nd in the championship. The fairest way to do so is to give the drivers a level playing field. Why allow Hamilton to jeopardise that by creating a situation in which both drivers could lose the result?

Mercedes had nothing to gain by allowing their drivers to have free reign. It's not their job to entertain, that responsibility lies with the directors of the sport. You can't blame Mercedes for doing what it takes to win. In the end, I think we'd have all done the same as them.

girry · Post by **girry** » 15 Nov 2015, 22:18

Mercedes have all rights to freeze post-start competition between their drivers if it wishes - but they lose all rights to complain about not getting broadcast time for their sponsors having chosen that approach.

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 15 Nov 2015, 22:23

Ataxia wrote:
AndreaModa wrote:The problem as far as I saw it today was control being taken from the driver and put into the hands of those on the pit wall. In the sense that we're no longer watching drivers race and be fully in control of everything they do. Hamilton, whether he was ultimately faster than Rosberg or not, wanted to try something different but was denied the possibility. I'd bet that anything he might have tried would have probably ended up unsuccessful, but again that's not the point. We weren't watching Rosberg and Hamilton racing today, we were watching a leading German car manufacturer lock down a race result that they believed would be beneficial to them without allowing their drivers any freedom to do what they want. That's not sport in my mind. It's an overly self concious company sucking the life out of sport.

Allow me to play devil's advocate here for a second, because I have a question; from Mercedes' perspective, why risk it? They had an objective here, which was to get Nico 2nd in the championship. The fairest way to do so is to give the drivers a level playing field. Why allow Hamilton to jeopardise that by creating a situation in which both drivers could lose the result?

Mercedes had nothing to gain by allowing their drivers to have free reign. It's not their job to entertain, that responsibility lies with the directors of the sport. You can't blame Mercedes for doing what it takes to win. In the end, I think we'd have all done the same as them.

I don't think taking the decision out of the drivers' hands strategy-wise promotes a level-playing field. That's what's getting my goat, the fact that the second placed driver, struggling to pass on track, was denied the opportunity to try something different. I'm not saying Mercedes should have come up with a different strategy for Hamilton, I believe he should be able to use his own initiative in these circumstances, but at the basic level they didn't allow it.

But I agree with you to a point about the team wanting their good result. I know it's not their job to entertain, strictly speaking. Maybe that's the problem with manufacturers and brands running teams. But irrespective of that, what we need in F1 is a situation where control is taken out of the hands of bottom line-driven suits on the pit wall and back at HQ. It needs to be in the hands of the drivers themselves, and I agree, that's not the responsibility of Mercedes to enact. It's the responsibility of a governing body that should grow a spine for a f*cking change.

Peteroli34 · Post by **Peteroli34** » 15 Nov 2015, 22:39

1. Renault - Introduces a new iimproved engine for the race ends up worse then the one it replaced.

2. Maximum Tyre Temperatures Who knew that was a thing

Spectoremg · Post by **Spectoremg** » 15 Nov 2015, 22:45

The race coverage - I was loving jumping to pit stops/the crowd/anything when there was something going on trackside. And endless shots of Nasr. Thank god Massa was having a lonely race.
HM: Coulthard picking on the reverend again.

Post by **DemocalypseNow** » 15 Nov 2015, 22:55

Tough one. Nothing sticks out like a sore thumb. Massa's Right-Rear being way too toasty for the FIA to handle was a pretty silly error. Was it human error? Perhaps, perhaps not, it may have just been a faulty blanket.

I'm going to give it to Renault, I think. 11 upgrade tokens and the powertrain is still as deficient in all departments as ever.

Aguaman · Post by **Aguaman** » 15 Nov 2015, 23:05

Sainz and STR - Basically since it was a miracle he started and then the camera pans on the car stopped.

HM - David Croft - Suggesting that Rosberg purposely blocked Lewis for revenge. Has Maldonado crashed yet website? You're a professional commentator. Leave that stuff for social media and home. Oh and that Mercedes were purposely slowling down their pitstops for Lewis to win.

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 15 Nov 2015, 23:22

Aguaman wrote:Has Maldonado crashed yet website?

Wait, wait, wait, Crofty actually brought up that website during the race? Dear HWNSNBM :facepalm:

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 15 Nov 2015, 23:25

Simtek wrote:
Aguaman wrote:Has Maldonado crashed yet website?

Wait, wait, wait, Crofty actually brought up that website during the race? Dear HWNSNBM

He did in Mexico as well.

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 16 Nov 2015, 02:05

So Renault aren't very good. Surprise!

Giving it to Williams/whatever turns out to have caused the overheated tyre.

DOSBoot · Post by **DOSBoot** » 16 Nov 2015, 02:13

1. Renault: You know you're in trouble when your new engine is worse than your old one.

2. The Race Itself: Brazil is usually a cracker. This one wasn't.

Zergon · Post by **Zergon** » 16 Nov 2015, 04:57

Ok, now this is a hard one mainly because no-one didn´t too all that badly.... I did consider Perez or Massa for losing their teammates quite clearly (Massa getting disqualified didn´t help either) and even Maldonado (which seems to be rather unpopular opinion here) simply because he´s the only one who I can think making a clear mistake during the race.

At the end, I just have to follow other´s here and give this one to Renault, that new engine wasn´t much of an upgrade now was it?

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 16 Nov 2015, 06:59

1 - Honda
2 - Er...

James1978 · Post by **James1978** » 16 Nov 2015, 07:19

Merc don't look they're changing their approach anytime soon.....so essentially all the races are decided on Saturday and/or the first corner.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121825

novitopoli · Post by **novitopoli** » 16 Nov 2015, 15:06

Carlos Sainz's car - Letting the driver down way too often during the last few races.

Fetzie · Post by **Fetzie** » 16 Nov 2015, 17:35

Zergon wrote:At the end, I just have to follow other´s here and give this one to Renault, that new engine wasn´t much of an upgrade now was it?

It was a downgrade

Renault spent development tokens and made the engine less powerful.

Aguaman · Post by **Aguaman** » 17 Nov 2015, 10:04

Salamander wrote:
Simtek wrote:
Aguaman wrote:Has Maldonado crashed yet website?

Wait, wait, wait, Crofty actually brought up that website during the race? Dear HWNSNBM

He did in Mexico as well.

Yeah. Crofty has been dire.

Post by **mario** » 17 Nov 2015, 17:55

Salamander wrote:
Simtek wrote:
Aguaman wrote:Has Maldonado crashed yet website?

Wait, wait, wait, Crofty actually brought up that website during the race? Dear HWNSNBM

He did in Mexico as well.

He's brought that website up quite a few times this season - I think that he might have mentioned it as far back as the Austrian GP where, following Maldonado's save when the car started fishtailing under braking, he joked that Maldonado had avoided ending up on that website again.

It isn't just confined to Croft either - Benson has brought up that website a few times on the live text updates on the BBC website, and I think that Coulthard has also made reference to it in his commentary too.

I guess that Sky and the BBC are both trying to get in on the joke as a way of indicating that they are in touch with the fans but, as you say, instead of being funny, it just looks unprofessional and childish.

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 17 Nov 2015, 18:00

I thought the idea behind the Maldonado website was amusing at first but, after checking it earlier and seeing it's been 71 days since his last crash, the joke's kinda over and were it my site I'd probably shut it down.