2010 Malaysian Grand Prix Discussion

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 02 Apr 2010, 10:41

2 practice sessions down and it looks like McLaren are on top while some other stuff happened (I'll look up the full practice results later)

watka · Post by **watka** » 02 Apr 2010, 14:39

McLaren and Mercedes seem to have caught up with Ferrari and Red Bull at this track at least. To early to say, but this could be one of those seasons where different tracks suit different cars (the whole Ferrari-McLaren, or Brawn-Red Bull track scenario) which would certainly make this season interesting.

IdeFan · Post by **IdeFan** » 02 Apr 2010, 16:06

watka wrote:McLaren and Mercedes seem to have caught up with Ferrari and Red Bull at this track at least. To early to say, but this could be one of those seasons where different tracks suit different cars (the whole Ferrari-McLaren, or Brawn-Red Bull track scenario) which would certainly make this season interesting.

Mclaren do seem to have found some speed, but the Merc (at least in Rosberg's hands) has been looking good on Fridays this year, only to be a little off come Saturday, i'd hold off till tomorrow to see if Merc have made any significant progress.

Looks like Lewis has come out swinging, it will be interesting to see if this results in awesome race pace or over exuberance.

Waris · Post by **Waris** » 02 Apr 2010, 16:44

From what we've seen thus far, it appears Ferrari and Red Bull are fast at mostly the same tracks, whereas McLaren and Mercedes seem to be fast at the same (other) tracks.

shinji · Post by **shinji** » 02 Apr 2010, 17:53

http://www.weather.com/weather/wxdetail/MYXX0031?dayNum=1&

Oh no. Or yes, depending.

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 02 Apr 2010, 18:29

Tomorrow morning, everyone will go into new tyres. Then we'll see; I find it hard to believe the Red Bull, which has been so blisteringly quick, won't be at the sharp end, despite Miley Cirrus' opinion:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/82603

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » 02 Apr 2010, 20:40

I don't get why you dare to compare Vettel with Miley Cyrus.

Post by **mario** » 02 Apr 2010, 20:54

Interesting factor is that the teams seem to be having some problems with the softer compound as the temperature gets higher - Button was complaining about the rear end loosing grip, and his tyres were graining up quite badly (particularly the left rear tyre). Oddly, at the other extreme, Ferrari are struggling to get their tyres to work properly - Alonso was swerving around on the straights at one point, when he couldn't get enough heat into the tyres, whilst Massa was complaining about graining and high tyre wear on the softer compound.
As a result, if you look carefully at the times, all of the quick times were actually set on the harder tyres this time around, as the softs were going off too quickly, it seems.

LucaPacchiarini · Post by **LucaPacchiarini** » 02 Apr 2010, 21:10

rain!

a Brambilla Race, hopefully

Pieman · Post by **Pieman** » 02 Apr 2010, 22:54

Phoenix wrote:I don't get why you dare to compare Vettel with Miley Cyrus.

Maybe we'll see both of them driving for USF1 next year.

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 03 Apr 2010, 06:16

Practice is complete for this weekend and Webber is only half a second away from the qualifying lap record :shock:

And I thought the FIA have been trying to slow down the cars for the last 6 years...

Cynon · Post by **Cynon** » 03 Apr 2010, 06:52

Just shows how serious their attempt is. If they REALLY want to slow the cars down they should ask Tony George on how to do it. Guarantee that the track record will be untouchable... 15 years later.

Collieafc · Post by **Collieafc** » 03 Apr 2010, 07:05

Surprised to see the Teutonic Titan finally get ahead of Rosberg. Then again, its only practise. Lets wait till the quali

TeamTipper · Post by **TeamTipper** » 03 Apr 2010, 07:34

Mclaren or Mercedes look really good in Malaysia, however in the second practice whiched I watched live Torro Rosso isnt to slow either. I hope its a mix day of weather so the results can be different. (note HRT catching up slowly good luck and Senna for the win lol)

Post by **DemocalypseNow** » 03 Apr 2010, 09:02

15th Kovalainen
16th Glock
17th Button
19th Alonso
20th Hamilton
21st Massa

Brilliant :mrgreen:

RAK · Post by **RAK** » 03 Apr 2010, 09:36

Looks like this was a qualifying session for the midfielders. Very good performance from Sutil and Hulkenberg, and nice showing from Kobayashi and Liuzzi. Nice upset order - just what we need for another exciting spectacle full of overtaking.

jackanderton · Post by **jackanderton** » 03 Apr 2010, 09:36

Bit gutted to see Sutil just miss out, but great call for intermediates by Webber. Red Bull can't screw this up, surely.

I reckon the race will be stopped tomorrow. Hopefully we'll get a decent amount of racing before then.

Great chance for Rosberg to end the likelihood of being the 21st century's Gerhard Berger.

eytl · Post by **eytl** » 03 Apr 2010, 09:40

Brilliant gamble on inters puts Mark Webber on pole and makes him the short-priced favourite for another Reject of the Race award when he bombs out in the race tomorrow.

Enough derision will be made of McLaren and Ferrari's boo-boos for me not to say anything - except that we are set for some overtaking tomorrow, so judgment reserved for the time being.

Rosberg STILL faster than Schumacher, even in adverse conditions when you would have thought that Michael would blast Nico away in his spray. Hmmm ...

Some of the wet-weather cream rising to the top - Sutil once again excellent, Hulkenberg was terrific, Kubica shows his class again, and even Kobayashi was a full second faster than de la Rosa in Q2.

Final note: an Australian on pole, ahead of FOUR Germans. Three of the last four on the grid are Brazilians.

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 03 Apr 2010, 09:44

That was crazy.. highlights are Rosberg and Hilkenberg beating their more experienced team-mates - who, by the way, will be sharing a line on the grid tomorrow. Tasty... will Webber walk it? His qualy lap was 1.3 seconds faster than everyone else's, and he wasn't the last to cross the line.

Phoenix wrote:I don't get why you dare to compare Vettel with Miley Cyrus.

I'm sorry, I din't know you were a fan. A will leave Ms Cyrus alone from now on. :mrgreen:

Enforcer · Post by **Enforcer** » 03 Apr 2010, 09:46

Was Rosberg on Intermediates or was he just awesome?

Debaser · Post by **Debaser** » 03 Apr 2010, 09:52

Enforcer wrote:Was Rosberg on Intermediates or was he just awesome?

He was both, and wiped the floor with Schumi in the process. Also Hulkenburg was fantastic, he's had hardly any wet weather experience and beat Barrichello convincingly. Still he and Sutil look like possible 1st corner casualties, Sutil is fast becoming a car wrecking machine.

jackanderton · Post by **jackanderton** » 03 Apr 2010, 09:53

will Webber walk it? His qualy lap was 1.3 seconds faster than everyone else's, and he wasn't the last to cross the line.

The performance level of those inters in what was still standard wet conditions to my eyes was breathtaking.

Webber deserves it, because the circumstances suggested conservatism would win out, and he still had the guts to get out there and throw it around on cold inters for 5 minutes to try and take pole.

As far as the race goes, the conditions will be changeable, and a race stoppage is highly probable. I doubt Webber even thinks he's favourite. Anything could happen.

Post by **mario** » 03 Apr 2010, 10:07

eytl wrote:Brilliant gamble on inters puts Mark Webber on pole and makes him the short-priced favourite for another Reject of the Race award when he bombs out in the race tomorrow.

Enough derision will be made of McLaren and Ferrari's boo-boos for me not to say anything - except that we are set for some overtaking tomorrow, so judgment reserved for the time being.

Rosberg STILL faster than Schumacher, even in adverse conditions when you would have thought that Michael would blast Nico away in his spray. Hmmm ...

Some of the wet-weather cream rising to the top - Sutil once again excellent, Hulkenberg was terrific, Kubica shows his class again, and even Kobayashi was a full second faster than de la Rosa in Q2.

Final note: an Australian on pole, ahead of FOUR Germans. Three of the last four on the grid are Brazilians.

Now you've said that, it is almost guaranteed that Webber will have some sort of malady along the way - although credit where it is due, that was a mighty lap by Webber. I suppose, though, that since Webber is now one engine short, having had an engine let go in the second practise session, a wet race would be what he would want - the slower running and cooler temperatures would reduce the stress on the engine, so he might be able to eke more out of it later. On the other hand, that decision to start on inters might yet backfire - if it is a wet race from the start, then he'll have to start on those tyres (unless it is a safety car start, when you have to start on the full wet tyre, as per the regulations). If it is wet enough for full wets, but dry enough for a regular start, then he'll be in all sorts of trouble...

Mclaren and Ferrari - well, I'll give this just a little bit of momentum here to get things going. What were they thinking? Mclaren should have remembered Monza 2008, when they sent Lewis out on inters when he needed wets, and by the time he was able to come back in, the track was too wet for him to set a fast lap. Ferrari, meanwhile, are fighting for the WDC here - they should have made sure that Alonso got a time in earlier, especially when Vettel was on track and going fairly quickly. Shame that Button aquaplaned off after going wide (although the fact that Petrov went off right behind him showed that particular corner must have been pretty tricky), as he really could have profited from Hamilton and the Ferrari duo's misfortunes and been mixing it with the other drivers to make things even more interesting.
Still, it should make for an interesting race tomorrow, especially if it is wet - and I suppose that the Mclaren and Ferrari duo can take some comfort in that they still have some fresh sets of wet tyres for tomorrow. Could well prove to be quite exciting to watch those guys charging up the order...

Rosberg and Schumacher - well, Rosberg was around a second faster then Schumacher at the end, although running behind him on the track would have helped (since the track would have been marginally drier where the others had driven). Ross credited Rosberg's quicker lap on the fact that he had a quite slow first lap - Schumacher pushed quite hard on his first lap, which he blames for over heating the tyres. It still isn't looking good for Schumacher - Rosberg seems to be faster then him, whatever the weather...

An interesting session all round - Sutil must be fancying his chances of a nice points haul from 4th, whilst Hulkenberg must also be feeling pretty confident (as will Williams - they have two cars in the top 10). Kubica was also doing quite well - that Renault seems to have good mechanical grip and traction, although he did fade a bit towards the end of the session. Kobayashi must also be hoping to steal a point or two as well if it rains tomorrow - he is going reasonably well, and Sauber seemed to be making the right strategic calls on the tyre choice today.

LionZoo · Post by **LionZoo** » 03 Apr 2010, 10:12

Enforcer wrote:Was Rosberg on Intermediates or was he just awesome?

Rosberg was on full wets. Only Webber was on inters.

jackanderton · Post by **jackanderton** » 03 Apr 2010, 10:14

Thing is mario, as we saw from the qualifying, the wet tyres are in the main redundant, because it doesn't rain steadily at Seang, which makes their margin of performance tiny.

The inters seem adequate for when it is wet but it isn't tipping it down, and when it is tipping it down, it's too dangerous to even be out there on full wets. At what point given those conditions do the wets come into their own? Answer, they don't really.

Martin Brundle pointed out that a car on a full fuel load on inters will be a bit of a handful in comparison to one on qualifying fuel levels. So I wonder what sort of call the teams will make- whether to go on wets to begin with and then switch to inters later if possible, or to switch to inters early and get that extra second a lap plus worth of speed and just hope nothing goes wrong.

It's exciting!

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » 03 Apr 2010, 10:30

CarlosFerreira wrote:
Phoenix wrote:I don't get why you dare to compare Vettel with Miley Cyrus.

I'm sorry, I din't know you were a fan. A will leave Ms Cyrus alone from now on.

Whoa whoa flippin' whoa. I din't know you found Vettel so attractive.

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 03 Apr 2010, 10:43

Phoenix wrote:
CarlosFerreira wrote:
Phoenix wrote:I don't get why you dare to compare Vettel with Miley Cyrus.

I'm sorry, I din't know you were a fan. A will leave Ms Cyrus alone from now on.

Whoa whoa flippin' whoa. I din't know you found Vettel so attractive.

He took over the mantle of "Hannah Montana lookalike" from Heidfeld. It's a close call between him and Rosberg, though.

Back on the qualifying, Kovalainen and Glock hit Q2, Chandhok beat Senna, and both HRTs beat di Grassi. And I have to bow to Petrov, he was only 0.5 sec away from Q3. Impressive reject showing, all of them.

FullMetalJack · Post by **FullMetalJack** » 03 Apr 2010, 11:22

From a slightly biased point of view, the highlight has to be both Williams cars in Q3. Hulkenburg was very impressive in particular to qualify 5th. What are the odds of him escaping rejectdom tomorrow?

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 03 Apr 2010, 11:56

redbulljack14 wrote:From a slightly biased point of view, the highlight has to be both Williams cars in Q3. Hulkenburg was very impressive in particular to qualify 5th. What are the odds of him escaping rejectdom tomorrow?

hmm... from a purely statistical point of view 1 in 6 (He has to finish in the top 4 to escape rejectdom in one go) but realisticly who knows with the weather like it is?

LucaPacchiarini · Post by **LucaPacchiarini** » 03 Apr 2010, 12:58

Loved to see Petrov countersteering his Renault three corners in a row under the puring rain...

And yet another solid performance by Force India! I'm really starting to love the team, especially Liuzzi although he's a bit of a chav

Archie2K · Post by **Archie2K** » 03 Apr 2010, 13:01

Wizzie wrote:
redbulljack14 wrote:From a slightly biased point of view, the highlight has to be both Williams cars in Q3. Hulkenburg was very impressive in particular to qualify 5th. What are the odds of him escaping rejectdom tomorrow?

hmm... from a purely statistical point of view 1 in 6 (He has to finish in the top 4 to escape rejectdom in one go) but realisticly who knows with the weather like it is?

Only if finishing positions are distributed by a uniform distribution.

Can I make an early nomination for Reject of the Race being David Coulthard's horrible white trousers from this morning's coverage?

Can I second the above prediction that rain will cause a red flag tomorrow. I reckon they'll run out of daylight, just hopefully they can get to 75% distance and award full points unlike last year's total farce.

watka · Post by **watka** » 03 Apr 2010, 13:20

Webber was stunning today. True he was on the right tyre and others were not, but he was really aggressive and controlled (rare for Webber) and put in a time 1.3 seconds faster than anyone else. The recent GP2-ists (Petrov, Kobayashi, and of course Hulkenberg) seemed to do well in the wet, I don't know if there is any correlation to be drawn from that, but they all seemed to be able to be quick and attack.

Of course, Ferrari and McLaren draw the biggest headlines with their big cock-ups. Under what circumstances do you not send your drivers out for a banker lap in the wet? It just smells of sheer arrogance, and hilariously they were beat by a Virgin and two Lotuses.

I think Bernie is also on for the most predictable ROTR ever. He knew the problem with the rain and the light last year, so he decides to move the quali and race even later. Some might say that he did it in order to ensure the rain and an exciting race (well it won't be exciting if it doesn't get running!). Anyone with a primary school education in Geography could tell you that the rain in tropical countries is immense, so why move the race to a time when it is more likely to downpour?

Archie2K · Post by **Archie2K** » 03 Apr 2010, 13:26

watka wrote:I think Bernie is also on for the most predictable ROTR ever. He knew the problem with the rain and the light last year, so he decides to move the quali and race even later. Some might say that he did it in order to ensure the rain and an exciting race (well it won't be exciting if it doesn't get running!). Anyone with a primary school education in Geography could tell you that the rain in tropical countries is immense, so why move the race to a time when it is more likely to downpour?

Hasn't the race been moved ahead by an hour? ie. 4pm local time not 5pm?
Not that it looks like it'll make much of a difference if rain causes a truncated race, or an impossible to follow stop-start affair, or a safety car led precession. If that happens, Bernie for ROTR without a doubt.

watka · Post by **watka** » 03 Apr 2010, 13:29

Archie2K wrote:
watka wrote:I think Bernie is also on for the most predictable ROTR ever. He knew the problem with the rain and the light last year, so he decides to move the quali and race even later. Some might say that he did it in order to ensure the rain and an exciting race (well it won't be exciting if it doesn't get running!). Anyone with a primary school education in Geography could tell you that the rain in tropical countries is immense, so why move the race to a time when it is more likely to downpour?

Hasn't the race been moved ahead by an hour? ie. 4pm local time not 5pm?
Not that it looks like it'll make much of a difference if rain causes a truncated race, or an impossible to follow stop-start affair, or a safety car led precession. If that happens, Bernie for ROTR without a doubt.

Ah yes, the point remains that he hasn't learned enough from last year though. The rainstorms keep occurring at the same point in the afternoon.

shinji · Post by **shinji** » 03 Apr 2010, 14:01

watka wrote: The recent GP2-ists (Petrov, Kobayashi, and of course Kobayashi) seemed to do well in the wet,

Hell yeah. He's that good.

Anyway, I didn't get up till 9:30, just before the end of Q2, and I was all like "WHERE ARE FERRARI AND MCLAREN OMG."

Tomorrow will be interesting. I certainly won't be ignoring the alarm.

watka · Post by **watka** » 03 Apr 2010, 14:20

Ha ha, epic typo. I meant Hulkenberg of course.

Debaser · Post by **Debaser** » 03 Apr 2010, 14:24

We may see the resurrection tomorrow - of the Burn from the Stern! About time we got a Suzuka 05 grid, and at Sepang you can overtake. Nonetheless I'm already voting the race starting time for ROTR, the thunderstorms may well lead to another red flagged race and it will all be because the race can't be put back an hour or two.

Post by **mario** » 03 Apr 2010, 15:20

watka wrote:Webber was stunning today. True he was on the right tyre and others were not, but he was really aggressive and controlled (rare for Webber) and put in a time 1.3 seconds faster than anyone else. The recent GP2-ists (Petrov, Kobayashi, and of course Hulkenberg) seemed to do well in the wet, I don't know if there is any correlation to be drawn from that, but they all seemed to be able to be quick and attack.

Of course, Ferrari and McLaren draw the biggest headlines with their big cock-ups. Under what circumstances do you not send your drivers out for a banker lap in the wet? It just smells of sheer arrogance, and hilariously they were beat by a Virgin and two Lotuses.

I think Bernie is also on for the most predictable ROTR ever. He knew the problem with the rain and the light last year, so he decides to move the quali and race even later. Some might say that he did it in order to ensure the rain and an exciting race (well it won't be exciting if it doesn't get running!). Anyone with a primary school education in Geography could tell you that the rain in tropical countries is immense, so why move the race to a time when it is more likely to downpour?

In the case of Ferrari and Mclaren, it seems to have been an over reliance on the weather predictions by Meteo France (who provide the weather predictions for both the teams and the FIA) - normally, they are quite good with their predictions (remember when they correctly predicted that it would start raining during the first lap of the German GP in 2007, as it duly did?), and the assumption that they would still have enough in hand for them to be able to make it into Q2. Unfortunately, only Button out of the quartet of Button, Hamilton, Massa and Alonso was able to set a time to get into Q2, as he was the first of those four out - only to aquaplane off when he was still on his intermediate tyres.

Either way, it was a decision that they will regret (probably Alonso will in particular - if Vettel can win, or at least get on the podium, and Alonso doesn't score, it'll take a sizeable chunk out of his lead in the WDC). Not only did Ferrari get beaten by some of those new teams which they have mocked so much in the past (which is the most delicious irony here), but they were beaten by the Virgin Racing team when they were running with an extra 30kg of fuel on board. http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/82673
Hopefully, though, it should have set the scene nicely for those at the back to launch a burn from the stern, and battle their way back up the order.

As for the timing, it is strange, especially given what happened last year, but because it is meant to follow on from Australia, it is hard to know where else it can slot into the calendar. Perhaps they could arrange it so it with some of the other long haul races, like Singapore and Suzuka? The only mitigating factor is that moving the race an hour forwards should give them a better chance to restart the race should it be red flagged (which it is going to be at some point).

jackanderton wrote:Thing is mario, as we saw from the qualifying, the wet tyres are in the main redundant, because it doesn't rain steadily at Sepang, which makes their margin of performance tiny.

The inters seem adequate for when it is wet but it isn't tipping it down, and when it is tipping it down, it's too dangerous to even be out there on full wets. At what point given those conditions do the wets come into their own? Answer, they don't really.

Martin Brundle pointed out that a car on a full fuel load on inters will be a bit of a handful in comparison to one on qualifying fuel levels. So I wonder what sort of call the teams will make- whether to go on wets to begin with and then switch to inters later if possible, or to switch to inters early and get that extra second a lap plus worth of speed and just hope nothing goes wrong.

It's exciting!

Well, it is true that the rain tyres are less useful, given how the intermediate tyres do have a wide operating range, and the intensity of the rainfall, but there was a phase of qualifying where the full wets were necessary and they could still run (towards the end of Q3, and at the beginning of Q2, they were running on full wets, but they could still proceed). So, if we have the same situation as today, when the initial rainfall was heavy, but not enough to flood the track entirely, then the full wets could come into play. That said, when they stopped running last year, I bet that there were a few who wished that Bridgestone hadn't got rid of the monsoon tyres a few years ago...

As for the race start, I would think that it is possible that the teams would prefer to stick to the intermediate tyres if possible, since they have a wider operating range then the full wets (as they don't over heat as quickly if the track dries). However, I fancy that if it is a little marginal, then some teams might go for the full wet tyres, and try to use the extra grip early on to make up a few places, and hope that they tyres don't over heat.

Paul Hayes · Post by **Paul Hayes** » 03 Apr 2010, 20:34

Sort of a lovely-looking grid, although I am a bit worried the Red Bulls will be able to run away and hide. But hopefully the weather and a safety car will spice things up a bit, as we see the McLarens and Ferraris show what they're made of as they take on the midfied pack.

shinji · Post by **shinji** » 03 Apr 2010, 20:39

Should we start taking bets how long the race will last before the red flag is introduced?