Jenson Button

[CarlosFerreira]

And so, it hits the fan.

[eagleash]

And so, it hits the fan.

Not really.........

Just don't post the video again.

[TomWazzleshaw]

What video?

Back on topic I will be the first to admit that I thought Button was making a massive mistake going to McLaren but so far he's forced me to eat my humble pie (To the point where I expect him to beat Lewis every race.) and the stats say it all really. Lewis has 2 wins, 1 2nd, 1 3rd, a pole and 2 fastest laps. Jenson has 2 wins, 2 2nds and is only 3 points behind Lewis. Lewis may be quicker over a single lap but over a race distance Jenson is level with him if not better.

I severely doubt anyone else will be able to do the job Jenson is doing in that McLaren right now. (Well... other than Lewis obviously )

[coops]

I severely doubt anyone else will be able to do the job Jenson is doing in that McLaren right now.

Alonso obviously couldnt

EDIT - (I know, I know they ended up with 109 points each. Someone was 2nd and someone was 3rd though)

[TomWazzleshaw]

I severely doubt anyone else will be able to do the job Jenson is doing in that McLaren right now.

Alonso obviously couldnt

Neither could Kovy but then again he probably has a case of Fisichellaitis (Good in midfield and backmarker teams, Not so good in the top teams)

[jackanderton]

Back to Jenson, I think he really has vindicated himself this year. Lewis is usually faster over the single lap, which means that Jenson is often at a disadvantage after qualifying. But in terms of overtaking, strategic thinking, and consistent race pace once the car gets dialled in, he's the equal and sometimes even the better of Lewis.

And the car is coming to him, or the other way around, as time passes and it gets developed -- it will be interesting to see what happens next year, when he has fully internalised the way a McLaren drives, and the designers know what he expects.

Steady on. They're both quality drivers but Lewis has the most talent. Button is at his peak as a driver right now and in my opinion has fulfilled and justified the promise and the investment put in, and surprised a lot of people along the way. Hamilton has some years ahead before he will reach his own peak, as he is yet to mature fully as an individual and as a skilled thinking racing driver. But what he possesses at this stage is pretty impressive.

[FullMetalJack]

I severely doubt anyone else will be able to do the job Jenson is doing in that McLaren right now.

Alonso obviously couldnt

Neither could Kovy but then again he probably has a case of Fisichellaitis (Good in midfield and backmarker teams, Not so good in the top teams)

Jenson Button is pretty much the opposite, great in a good car but crap in a dog of a car, except 2007 where he drove quite well.

[CarlosFerreira]

Steady on. They're both quality drivers but Lewis has the most talent. Button is at his peak as a driver right now and in my opinion has fulfilled and justified the promise and the investment put in, and surprised a lot of people along the way. Hamilton has some years ahead before he will reach his own peak, as he is yet to mature fully as an individual and as a skilled thinking racing driver. But what he possesses at this stage is pretty impressive.

Quote of the Month, right there.

The simple fact this thread exists shows how we underrated Jenson and the extent of his achievement, but Lewis? Frankly, another planet*.

*Disclaimer: I don't follow his exploits outside the track. Don't care about the WAG, piercing, dad or whatever. I'm talking about the guy behind the wheel, just.

[eagleash]

Real greats make poor cars look good.
When last years McLaren sucked, Lewis looked poor.

@ Carlos....you know your disclaimer won't stop me copying & pasting don't you

[IdeFan]

Real greats make poor cars look good.
When last years McLaren sucked, Lewis looked poor.

@ Carlos....you know your disclaimer won't stop me copying & pasting don't you

Id say not so much poor as inconsistent. He had a couple of good drives before the car got sorted, most notably in Oz (before it got tarnished by liegate) but at other times he was pretty poor. However given how Kovalainen never got anywhere near him once the car got "sorted" suggests that even towards the end of the season the car was still sub par, he was driving the wheels off it.

Jenson has never really looked great in bad cars, 2007 was the exception, but '01, '05 and '08 he looked very average, at times last year he didn't look good when the Brawn wasn't performing, with Rubens coping better.

[eagleash]

We already know that Kovalainen can't drive a good car. Referred to elsewhere as Fisichellitis.
Still would say Hamilton looked poor trolling around at the back seemingly disinterested, which brings into question his attitude generally, as we saw in Turkey. Lewis would like us to believe that if Jenson was leading he would just hold station behind him. Think we all know the answer to that one. With probably a crumpled Macca somewhere in the equation.
Jenson has looked poor also at times in the past but no genuine commentator has called into question his ability & all drivers have ups & downs in form from time to time.

[Tealy]

We already know that Kovalainen can't drive a good car. Referred to elsewhere as Fisichellitis.
Still would say Hamilton looked poor trolling around at the back seemingly disinterested, which brings into question his attitude generally, as we saw in Turkey. Lewis would like us to believe that if Jenson was leading he would just hold station behind him. Think we all know the answer to that one. With probably a crumpled Macca somewhere in the equation.
Jenson has looked poor also at times in the past but no genuine commentator has called into question his ability & all drivers have ups & downs in form from time to time.

I would argue who has ever done well consistantly in a poor car. Generally the best drivers will show flashes of brilliance in a poor car but never do amazingly well in it. I have to agree though that Hamilton's attitude in the first half of last season showed that he wasn't fully into it.

[jackanderton]

Real greats make poor cars look good.
When last years McLaren sucked, Lewis looked poor.

@ Carlos....you know your disclaimer won't stop me copying & pasting don't you

That would be all well and good if people were describing Hamilton as a 'great'. He's a few seasons into his F1 career and done some pretty great stuff, and may well impress down the field in future as his temperament and technical feedback improves- that's something about experience though, not about pace. Most greats quite obviously end up in the teams with the fastest cars. Lewis was extraordinarily unlucky to be in a McLaren so poor it was around 16th place at one point- that isn't a challenge many if any drivers in the top teams are forced into, especially not in his 3rd season.

I have no idea how a 'great' manages to make a car that is mechanically and aerodynamically 1.5 seconds slower than the car at the front 'look good' but perhaps you can explain.

[CarlosFerreira]

Let's not get carried away with the discussion, but may I point out that, on last year's very poor McLaren, Hamilton looked very good. Inconsistent (Monaco, Monza...) but much more capable to drive on the limit and beyond than not-a-slouch Kovalainen. That, on my mind, just shows Jenson's current efforts under an even better light.

[Collieafc]

I'll admit Im one who got a wrong prediction here with Button. Not only is he matching Hamilton but he also made an overtake maneuver! (in Canada)

That said, hes still quick to blame others, and according to him, its never his fault when things go wrong. And I personally still find him dull to watch, at least compared to Hamilton. Im no fan of Hamilton either but will freely admit that I find him somewhat entertaining as he usually makes a go of everything

[Phoenix]

Joining late but...
I concede that Button is performing better than expected, but I still see it a bit behind Hamilton in normal conditions. But he's getting the hang of things more and more with each race passing. If things are kept as civil as they are now, by soon we could see a real duel between Hamilton and Button in each race (apart from the one in Turkey).

[CarlosFerreira]

blahblahblah

PHOENIX IS BACK!

[Phoenix]

blahblahblah

PHOENIX IS BACK!

Someone is greeting me back! Sorry, I was busy with exams and other things; that's life (not Life)...
And now, about Jenson Button...

[CarlosFerreira]

And now, about Jenson Button...

Oh, I don't care about that.

[Phoenix]

And now, about Jenson Button...

Oh, I don't care about that.

You should. He is the reigning World Champion

[coops]

blahblahblah

PHOENIX IS BACK!

AND THIS TIME ITS PERSONAL!!

[CarlosFerreira]

blahblahblah

PHOENIX IS BACK!

AND THIS TIME ITS PERSONAL!!

Phoenix 2: Electric Bogaloo.

[shinji]

And now, about Jenson Button...

Oh, I don't care about that.

You should. He is the reigning World Champion

Meh. He's not reigning in my heart.

[FullMetalJack]

And now, about Jenson Button...

Oh, I don't care about that.

Meh. He's not reigning in my heart.

He's a 2 time Reject of the Year, show some respect for him.

[eagleash]

We already know that Kovalainen can't drive a good car. Referred to elsewhere as Fisichellitis.
Still would say Hamilton looked poor trolling around at the back seemingly disinterested, which brings into question his attitude generally, as we saw in Turkey. Lewis would like us to believe that if Jenson was leading he would just hold station behind him. Think we all know the answer to that one. With probably a crumpled Macca somewhere in the equation.
Jenson has looked poor also at times in the past but no genuine commentator has called into question his ability & all drivers have ups & downs in form from time to time.

I would argue who has ever done well consistantly in a poor car. Generally the best drivers will show flashes of brilliance in a poor car but never do amazingly well in it. I have to agree though that Hamilton's attitude in the first half of last season showed that he wasn't fully into it.

I would cite off the top of my head without stopping to think about it; Senna at Toleman (Brands '84 there was only one thing people talked about) & Moss at almost everywhere except Mercedes. (250F notwithstanding).

[eagleash]

Real greats make poor cars look good.
When last years McLaren sucked, Lewis looked poor.

@ Carlos....you know your disclaimer won't stop me copying & pasting don't you

That would be all well and good if people were describing Hamilton as a 'great'. He's a few seasons into his F1 career and done some pretty great stuff, and may well impress down the field in future as his temperament and technical feedback improves- that's something about experience though, not about pace. Most greats quite obviously end up in the teams with the fastest cars. Lewis was extraordinarily unlucky to be in a McLaren so poor it was around 16th place at one point- that isn't a challenge many if any drivers in the top teams are forced into, especially not in his 3rd season.

I have no idea how a 'great' manages to make a car that is mechanically and aerodynamically 1.5 seconds slower than the car at the front 'look good' but perhaps you can explain.

I would say that would be because their greater ability extracts more from the car. The word used here was "good"....not "world beater".