The Sportscar and Endurance Thread

Nessafox · Post by **Nessafox** » 28 Aug 2014, 21:08

Slightly related to sportscars, but defenitely endurance: for the first time in ages the Zolder 24 hours appear to have a full grid. They finally realised that allowing GT3's in a 24 hour race in the same country as the 24h of Spa is not a good idea. So they got rid of the big guns and are allowing cars like Mazda MX5's back on the grid. We still got to see a few slower GT's and a few Proto's and Silhouttes between all the touring cars, so it's varied.
I'm still not convinced to spend my money on it, because of a general decline in interest of live motorsport (i can hear them from my home right now, in qualifying anyway), but i'm happy they are getting themselves back together, 50 amateur cars are without doubt better than 20 proffessional cars for an endurance race.
It's still a bit ridiculous that some cars have up to 6 drivers on it, but realistically, it's probably the only way the race can survive.

Nessafox · Post by **Nessafox** » 31 Aug 2014, 01:27

Well, there is a F1 connection in the 24H of Zolder, with an Italian constructor who bought the naming rights to Wolf. Their works car is currently second, and their second car, with a team named 'Shadow' is third. Can these cars last the distance and win the thing? Probably not because the Porshes from the experiencied team with the original name 'Belgium racing' are traditionally very strong, whilst the Wolf cars didn't make the distance last year. Also all other proto's (like the Radicals) have fallen back, because of reliability issues, and Porsche cup cars always score very well in Zolder.
For the many Aussies here, theres 3 Ford Focus from a team called Marc Cars, who are planning to conquer all European endurance races, their cars are currently 4th, 7th and 28th. Not bad for an Aussie team. They can be the real surprise of the race, if they keep this up. And just when i wrote this, their first car dropped to 6th, quite a commentators curse there, i guess 'Aussie bad luck' is going to be their biggest enemy.
Edit: yup i just totally cursed that car, half an hour later it's dropping out of the top 10 :lol:

Nessafox · Post by **Nessafox** » 31 Aug 2014, 17:57

So the Wolf works car did last, but only got a second place, the Shadow Wolf fell back, but could still get a 7th place (out of 41 classified cars, which is really a lot)
So how did the Aussies do? One of their cars made it into a 5th place, winning their category (altough there were only 4 cars in this category, and 3 of them were the Aussies), the other two cars fell back, but a 12th and 16th place isn't too bad. But to compare, the 13h placed car was a Mini , so on the other hand, that's not so impressive. Apparently, Mini cup cars seem to be pretty good endurance cars and superior to Clio cup, BMW cup and Mazda cup cars, who knew? The victory is the same car as last year, a Porsche from Belgium racing, and their second car came third, just like last year... These guys should really try to do a more serious effort in Spa, as it seems they really got the hang out of this endurance thing (they usually race in the Benelux Porsche cup). After all, this is the same place a team like Prospeed learned their ways. (and Prospeed were usually only DNFing, it seems they kept that tradition alive in other series)

Post by **Miguel98** » 21 Sep 2014, 17:18

After the red flag yesterday in Austin that shortened the race and gave the win to the Audi driven by Treluyer, Lotterer and Duval, Alexander Wurz isn't happy with lot of things. Since he came to the pits while he was running 3rd and the race got red flagged in that moment, he suddenly, on the restart, was 6th and a lap down on the leaders.

And now: this.

FMecha · Post by **FMecha** » 01 Oct 2014, 07:42

DTM and Super GT announces Class One to unify their rules further. 4 cyl 2.0 turbos powering 600 hp is stated, and IMSA is said to announce a new series using Class One system.

Speaking of which, any nominations for Super GT rejects?

watka · Post by **watka** » 02 Oct 2014, 23:18

FMecha wrote:DTM and Super GT announces Class One to unify their rules further. 4 cyl 2.0 turbos powering 600 hp is stated, and IMSA is said to announce a new series using Class One system.

Speaking of which, any nominations for Super GT rejects?

Sounds awesome, I've always hoped that they would one day race together.

RealRacingRoots · Post by **RealRacingRoots** » 03 Oct 2014, 00:05

watka wrote:Sounds awesome, I've always hoped that they would one day race together.

There were plans to have a combined event. However, those fell apart quickly when the Germans realised they were going to get slaughtered by their Japanese counterparts.

Wallio · Post by **Wallio** » 03 Oct 2014, 17:18

FMecha wrote:DTM and Super GT announces Class One to unify their rules further. 4 cyl 2.0 turbos powering 600 hp is stated, and IMSA is said to announce a new series using Class One system.

I guess this kills those rumors of Aussie V8s adopting the same rules.......

Still very cool.

watka · Post by **watka** » 06 Oct 2014, 23:45

RealRacingRoots wrote:
watka wrote:Sounds awesome, I've always hoped that they would one day race together.

There were plans to have a combined event. However, those fell apart quickly when the Germans realised they were going to get slaughtered by their Japanese counterparts.

How so? Or is that just your opinion?

RealRacingRoots · Post by **RealRacingRoots** » 13 Oct 2014, 07:37

watka wrote:
RealRacingRoots wrote:
watka wrote:Sounds awesome, I've always hoped that they would one day race together.

There were plans to have a combined event. However, those fell apart quickly when the Germans realised they were going to get slaughtered by their Japanese counterparts.

How so? Or is that just your opinion?

That is for truth. The rate of development for the Super GT runners is far too great for DTM to catch up considering DTM is running on a stock tire (and therefore less potential from damper improvements) and with development being mostly frozen. Super GT have one mandated Joker-Update anytime of the year, a Fuji Low-Drag Spec, and then for the NSX Concept additional upgrades because it's Mid-Engined and a Hybrid, Evolution of Technology it's called. Before this year developments in terms of Aero had no chance of slowing down the rate of development unless they mandated that they have to slow down. Super GT also has a very-insane tire war going on with the likes of Bridgestone, Michelin, Yokohama and one Dunlop-shod team trying to be the fastest, which also promoted developments in terms of suspension geometry and parts. Mind you both cars do have the same tub and same dimensions, and soon the same engine formula.

In qualifying trim, Rob Wickens's Pole lap from Spielberg this year would have put him second to last of the LMP2 runners in the ELMS Race at Spielberg, while the Super GT cars would be deep in the scrap for top honors in LMP2 going by their pace at Fuji. It is a bit of a case of comparing apples to oranges, because Super GT is a GT/Endurance series while DTM is a Touring Car series, but in the end the same (or similar) rulebook produced two racing series, and one that people actually like.

watka · Post by **watka** » 15 Oct 2014, 00:18

So it turns out that it got pretty wet at the 6 hours of the COTA: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSQJaemend0#t=1686

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 19 Nov 2014, 13:25

Two big announcements on Autosport:

1. Tom Kristensen is retiring.
2. Emerson Fittipaldi will be making a racing comeback for AF Corse at Interlagos.

Dj_bereta · Post by **Dj_bereta** » 19 Nov 2014, 22:59

Simtek wrote:Two big announcements on Autosport:

1. Tom Kristensen is retiring.
2. Emerson Fittipaldi will be making a racing comeback for AF Corse at Interlagos.

A shame FIA don't giving a license for Pietro for racing with his grandfather.

MorbidelliObese · Post by **MorbidelliObese** » 21 Nov 2014, 10:48

Absolute legend of the sport, as with McNish I'm glad to see him going out on his own terms while still competitive, Le Mans will be weird next year though.

Wonder what Audi will do, whether promoting one of their #3 drivers to the full time ride or looking elsewhere (whether a Button or someone from a rival/Rebellion/LMP2)

Totally out of the blue with the Emmo news as well, be interesting to see how he gets on, I'd have been watching anyway but if it gets the local interest up that can only be a good thing.

Waris · Post by **Waris** » 22 Nov 2014, 22:01

This news about Fittipaldi makes this the first time I actually want to watch an endurance race, although I doubt I can sit through six hours of nonstop racing.

Post by **Ataxia** » 27 Nov 2014, 15:51

Nico Hulkenberg will be driving at the Le Mans 24 Hours in 2015 along with his Force India drive next year.

Dj_bereta · Post by **Dj_bereta** » 27 Nov 2014, 16:44

Ataxia wrote:Nico Hulkenberg will be driving at the Le Mans 24 Hours in 2015 along with his Force India drive next year.

In other words: If Nico doesn't secure a good race seat in the next years, he is going to leave F1.

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 27 Nov 2014, 17:08

Ataxia wrote:Nico Hulkenberg will be driving at the Le Mans 24 Hours in 2015 along with his Force India drive next year.

That'll be the first time since Bourdais in 2009 that a regular driver will race Le Mans and F1 in the same year. I'd like to see this more often.

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 27 Nov 2014, 18:31

Really good news, and a real sign that the WEC is growing in stature. It would be good to see a few more drivers doing stuff like this, across other disciplines too. I'm really looking forward to the WEC next year - four factory LMP1 teams, lots of other interest in the other classes, it's going to be good! They'll almost need to start thinking about splitting the prototypes and GT cars into separate races at this rate, the grid won't be big enough!

Now if they could just sort out the bloody calendar...

MorbidelliObese · Post by **MorbidelliObese** » 28 Nov 2014, 13:15

Yep great news, it's a great throwback to when this used to happen more often, if he does well maybe it'll open the door for others to try cross-discipline stuff.

Keeping my fingers crossed that Button can manage to get a full time WEC ride too, definitely won't be at Porsche (who are keeping the same regular 6 drivers), an opening at Audi but I'm guessing they'll promote one of their part-timers into TK's old berth, Toyota might lose a driver or two but have Conway ready to jump into a full time role, not sure about Nissan's driver plans yet.

Agreed on the calendar through, at the very least the gap between Le Mans and the next round has been ridiculously long the last couple of years and should be shorter. That and the lack of solid LMP1 privateer opposition for Rebellion were the only two downers on the season for me.

nome66 · Post by **nome66** » 28 Nov 2014, 18:09

now all we need is daytona, sebring, and a ferrari team and we're set

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 28 Nov 2014, 23:31

I'm in agreement that Hülkenberg's racing for Porsche at Spa and Le Mans is welcomed. In fact, I love this occurance!

[quote="AndreaModa]Now if they could just sort out the bloody calendar...[/quote]

Autosport wrote a decent piece about how the WEC can grow if it gets away from a calendar centered around the Le Mans 24 hours. I can only imagine why...

nome66 · Post by **nome66** » 29 Nov 2014, 06:54

they need the "big three" back

Dj_bereta · Post by **Dj_bereta** » 29 Nov 2014, 16:09

Fittipaldi was only 2s slower than his teammates in the practice session. Impressive if you consider he doesn't race since 1996.

Post by **Miguel98** » 30 Nov 2014, 21:59

Well, that was a great end to the season of WEC. Even though Webber crashed really hard, and it ruined what could've been a great ending to the race, it was still a great race. If WEC get's a decent calendar, and changes a couple of things, it's in the right direction.

Though, during the Eurosport tranmission of the last two hours, the portuguese commentators mentioned something which I find a bit worrying:
The FIA want to change the rules for 2015, two which might be good, and one which I can't quite understand. They want to put tyre restritements per weekend, reducing it for 6-7 set of tyres available, with the option two from the weekend before that. I mean, what an actual bathplug is this rule? It's stupid.

nome66 · Post by **nome66** » 12 Jan 2015, 16:18

we should all know what this means.
http://www.carscoops.com/2015/01/all-ne ... n.html?m=1
or at least know what the new DP should look like in due time. http://autoweek.com/article/sports-cars ... nassi-2016

Yannick · Post by **Yannick** » 17 Jan 2015, 20:50

IndyCar driver Mikhail Aleshin moving to LMP2, says SMP Racing team principal Sergey Zlobin:

http://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/ales ... mp-racing/

(includes other quotes from former A1-GP driver Zlobin, a favourite of Jamie and Enoch's).

Post by **Frogfoot9013** » 19 Jan 2015, 17:24

An interesting image of the Nissan LMP1 car posted on Facebook by the ever-reliable source Taki Inoue.

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 19 Jan 2015, 20:19

There's a whole article on Jalopnik including a short video. Here's another image. Haven't had confirmation on whether Robin was in the passenger seat yet.

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 19 Jan 2015, 20:56

To be honest, the Nissan LMP1 looks like it is front enigne-rear drive, instead of a mid engine-rear drive car. It looks like a turn of the century Panoz, in a way.

nome66 · Post by **nome66** » 20 Jan 2015, 04:00

this is odd to me for some reason. likely because we are all adjusted so well to mid/rear engined cars

Post by **mario** » 20 Jan 2015, 18:09

go_Rubens wrote:To be honest, the Nissan LMP1 looks like it is front enigne-rear drive, instead of a mid engine-rear drive car. It looks like a turn of the century Panoz, in a way.

That was a rumour that had been kicking around for a while, and the first impressions would appear to confirm that is indeed the case, as well as confirming the rumours that the rear tyres would be much smaller than the front tyres.

It's a shame that he wasn't able to get more of a look at the rear end of the car, especially given the very strange design of the rear wing mounts (it's odd to see such a large cut out in the side panels) - and, as nome66 points out, overall the car is a pretty strange looking beast compared to the other cars that you see at Le Mans these days. It could look even more unusual if one of the other rumours - that they are planning on getting rid of the rear wing altogether in low downforce trim, thus maximising the straight line performance of the car for Le Mans - turns out to be true too.

Wallio · Post by **Wallio** » 21 Jan 2015, 19:44

It's been confirmed as being "Front-mid-engined" which is marketing speak for the engine being completely. behind the front axel. Chevy started this malarkey by claiming the layout was "sporty" (for its Vettes). Which means a ''32 Ford Highboy, (or any pre-war American car) is "sporty".

Don't car though, I LOVE this. Best looking LMP1 since the old Panoz.

Nessafox · Post by **Nessafox** » 21 Jan 2015, 20:40

At least we got some variation! You won't see this in F1 for the first 50 years

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 21 Jan 2015, 21:45

On reflection, I can't wait to see how this turns out. Easily the most unique design of a racing car in the higher echelons of motorsport in a very long time. I have read rumors of an insane amount of horsepower, with some suggesting that the car could have well over 1000 (and I mean a decent bit) all things considered. The acceleration in the video suggested to me that the car is no slouch in that department.

With the idea of the front-mid-engine LMP1, I have to wonder how the car's weight is distributed. We know that mid-engine layouts offer the best overall balance in terms of weight distribution. Is the case being that the engine is in the front, while the energy recovery systems are in the rear to counterbalance the engine's weight (likely helped by the driver's weight as well), which perhaps could mean the use of larger systems? Perhaps this is a way to enable the use of more power which is suggested by few? What regulations on size of the energy recovery systems and items like flywheels and supercapacitors are there? I think the GTR LMP1 could be a completely revolutionary prototype in terms of design philosophy to try and find the extra edge, in particular over more "standard" cars?

ADx_Wales · Post by **ADx_Wales** » 22 Jan 2015, 18:55

The Nissan LMP is a GTR, so anything other than Front Engine would be meaningless.

It is also FRONT Wheel Drive...

...with the hybrid power going to the rear wheels. (everyone in LMP1-H has either a battery or a flywheel hybrid system similar to Kers, its not restricted in its use, however there are selected breaking areas on circuits where the energy can be harvested)

The rumour is, under the right circumstance, if they're not using the hybrid for a while and they've harvested as much energy as possible, its will unleash 2000hp (two thousand horse powers) onto the tarmac!

ADx_Wales · Post by **ADx_Wales** » 22 Jan 2015, 19:13

nome66 wrote:they need the "big three" back

Needs to be FIA Grade 1* circuits (with the exception of Le Mans, Because its Le Mans), thats why Daytona and Sebring are a no-no.

Daytona's banking and infield is probably too dangerous, especially after the Rolex 24 Smash involving Memo Gidley on the infield in the sunset and a slow 458.

I'd like to see Sebring back more than Daytona, but its still not FIA Savvy, its too bumpy, the 1997 FIA GT race ran on a layout that detoured around the outside of the bumpy entry to the final turn.

You may not find this to be good news, but they're planning to use the Indy GP Layout in 2016 instead of COTA. I'd rather see them go back there than any of the other ones, because you'd have to have Herman Tilke throw his obligatory tarmac run offs and triple apex infield stadium sections, I'd rather not see that happen to any of the classic american circuits.

*I think,

As for a Ferrari works team, can't see the problem with the Amato Ferrari Corse cars in GTe, and thats probably their view of it too.

Alonso's presence at Le Mans last year doesnt help but spur the thought on even further, but all he did was express his own interest rather than theirs, that's why it took so damn long for him to sign with Mclaren, because Honda didn't want him to do Le Mans.

Post by **tommykl** » 22 Jan 2015, 21:38

ADx_Wales wrote:Daytona's banking and infield is probably too dangerous, especially after the Rolex 24 Smash involving Memo Gidley on the infield in the sunset and a slow 458.

While I do agree that Sebring and Daytona will probably not be on the calendar anytime soon, I think it would be more a case of culture clashes and the reputation that the Daytona 24 has built for itself.

Gidley's accident could have happened anywhere, and the prototypes catching air seem to be products of the car's bodies, and not the tracks. I don't see why Daytona (using the infield circuit) couldn't host a WEC round.

Waris · Post by **Waris** » 23 Jan 2015, 00:16

Yeah I agree, Daytona and Sebring belong on the calendar, FIA Grade 1 or not. I think the FIA insistence on Grade 1 for "safety" reasons is a bit hypocritical, probably political too. I mean if so many series using similar cars to FIA series can hold races on non-Grade 1 tracks, why can't the FIA series? If safety is the reason, doesn't that basically amount to the FIA saying the safety of non-FIA series is not as important as that of their own series?

Anyway. Speaking of Daytona, is anyone here planning to watch it live?

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 23 Jan 2015, 00:49

Waris wrote:Speaking of Daytona, is anyone here planning to watch it live?

Well, I definitely will if Fox Sports 1 is showing the race. If the contract with USCC from Fox doesn't exist anymore, that's completely fine. I won't care because Fox is a disgrace in America, anywhere from their news to their entertainment. It's no wonder they're so popular because Americans are too stupid. No further on that note...

I hope Rubens Barrichello does well in the Starworks DP. Starworks have a great record in endurance racing since the beginning of 2012, so it's hard to not say they won't be in contention for the victory. I've wanted to see Rubens do more endurance racing, and I'm getting it for the big overall win for once. I hope the LMP2 cars are a little faster in comparison to the DPs. Last season the DPs were really too fast for the LMP2 cars because of their power, most notably at Daytona.

In terms of my opinion on the WEC calendar, Sebring should be in the series. Plus, there should be set distance races within the series as well, not just time limits. I'd love to see a 1000 mile race. The calendar lacks variation. Different sets of distances plus having the big 3 would be the most suitable option. The only reason why Audi stayed in contention for the manufacturer's title last season was because of Le Man's double points from their arguably shock 1-2.

If the Nissan has a hybrid system that delivers, along with the actual engine, over 2000bhp, for the GTR-LMP1, I'd have to say I'd reapect them for getting that much power out of both units. Sounds like a car for Le Mans...