2010 Driver Market

watka · Post by **watka** » 03 Oct 2009, 14:06

You're all wrong.

Monster Brawn Mercedes

0 - Michael Schumacher
1 - Jenson Button

Jenson Button painstakingly wins the 2009 championship by virtue of an 8th place in Abu Dhabi, which has him level on points with Barrichello, but wins by virtue of race wins. Monster puts more sponsorship into the team, the team's cars and uniform are covered in black, with luminous green eyes, claws, and teeth everywhere. Ross Brawn is dramatically reunited with Michael Schumacher, who thrashes Button and leads the championship at the half way point of the season, before finally retiring due to crippling arithitis. A number of drivers fill in for the remainder of the season, including Alex Wurz, Giancarlo Fisichella, and Luca Badoer, all with limited success.

Red Bull Renault

3 - Sebastien Vettel
4 - Mark Webber

A similar story again for Red Bull, keeping the same driver line up. The cars are blisteringly fast, but Webber records the record number of retirements in the season; his car hitting a dog in Turkey, getting hit by Vettel in Germany, getting hit by the Toro Rossos in Italy, and turning the engine off on the final lap at Australia when in the lead and waving to the fans. Vettel's engine blows up at some point each weekend, including on the grid at Valencia, in the dark in Singapore, in the pitlane in Britain, and behind the safety car in Canada.

Santander Ferrari

5 - Fernando Alonso
6 - Rubens Barrichello

Alonso is signed on a $500000000000000000000000000000000000000 a year contract which sees the Fiat company close down its road car manufacture in order to concentrate on dominating the F1 championship for the next decade at least. They succeed, as Alonso goes on to win every title until 2027. Rubens Barrichello is brought back to Fezza as Massa fails to recover (he banged his head climbing out of a simulator, did Alonso deliberately ensure this happened?) and drive-less Barrichello is drafted in due to his proven skill at being a #2 driver.

Vodafone Mclaren Peugeot

7 - Lewis Hamilton
8 - Sebastien Bourdais

After Mercedes shockingly pull out on the McLaren team, Martin Whitmarsh is forced to rekindle the team's relationship with Peugeot, who see a chance to get one over the disgraced Renault brand. Sebastien Bourdais comes as part of the deal. The car looks beautful in silver, golden, and red colours, but is the slowest car in the field by some margin. Bourdais outpaces Hamilton throughout the first half of the season, but goes to USF1 when he is thrown out in favour of Stephane Sarrazin from Valencia onwards. Sarrazin's performance take the team to their lowest point in their history.

Rothmans (R????????) Williams Renault

9 - Nigel Mansell
10 - Jacques Villeneuve

On announcing a deal with Renault for customer engines, Patrick Head and Sir Frank Williams get a little bit nostalgic, and rehire Mansell and Villeneuve to drive for the team, with Riccardo Patrese as the experienced test driver. The team put in some brilliant performances; Mansell leading in Australia until his tyre exploded (although this time, he went straight into the gravel and performed a spectacular barrel roll), and Villeneuve battling with Schumacher in Spain until deliberately turning into the German's sidepod and ending up in the gravel. The car is often too technologically advanced for the drivers though, as they frequently run into the back of other cars when deploying the flywheel KERS system.

Hello-Kitty Daihatsu

11 - Takuma Sato
12 - Yuji Ide

Toyota decide to cut off the board room democracy, move the team out of Cologne, rebrand themselves as Daihatsu, and employ Aguri Suzuki as team principal. Suzuki wastes no time in employing trusted drivers Sato and Ide, with Hideki Noda as test driver, and also commissions the cars colouring to be designed by Japanese anime and manga artists. The team become cult heroes in Japan, with their highly erratic performances, but Toyota/Daihatsu win their first grand prix with Sato in Japan. Ide frequently crashes out of points paying positions and never escapes rejectdom. The team is pulled at the end of the 2010 year.

Kingfisher Force India Tata

14 - Narain Karthikeyan
15 - Karun Chandhok

Vijay Mallya gives in to the pressure from Bernie and moves the whole team's operations to Mumbai. The team's travel costs soar, but with Indian drivers Karthikeyan (the "experienced one") and Karun Chandhok (the "talented one") bringing in sponsorship, that's not a problem. The team decide on Tata engines, which have less power than a milk-float, but they still easily outpace the McLarens at the start of the season.

Renault

16 - Robert Kubica
17 - Rrrrrrrrmmmmmmmnnnnnnn Grrrrrrrjjjjjjjjjnnnnnnn

Renault continue to plod on in F1, despite no sponsors, and Bob Bell at the helm. Kubica leads the team, and is heavily favoured over Grjn, Grjn often sent out with flat/bald/no tyres in order to keep the best rubber for Bobby K. This escalates over the year to the point where Grjn is sent out in a rolling chassis, with 2 engines wielded together to make a V20 in the back of Kubica's car. Grjn is repeatedly accused of crashing the car deliberately and handing unlikely podiums to Kubica, but telemetry proves over and over again, that he is just being crap.

Doimo Toro-Rosso-Minardi Mugen-Honda

18 - Sebastien Ogier
19 - Jean Eric Vergne

Red Bull leave Toro Rosso to fend for itself, but they continue their youth and Sebastien policies. Ogier is chosen to head the team, preferred over Loeb, who tested for the team extensively, due to his age. Alguersuari is considered "past it", so they pick Jean Eric Vergne from Formula Renault. The team surprise everyone by picking up Mugen-Honda engines, and then surprise even more by taking 3rd place in the constructors championship behind Ferrari and Brawn on sheer pace rather than luck. Paul Stoddart is frequently seen being man-handled out of the F1 paddock and the Faenza by heavies.

YouTube USF1 Cosworth

20 - Scott Speed
21 - Al Unser Jr

USF1 go with the experience of Scott Speed, who's back and as big mouthed as ever, and the...erm...experience of Al Unser Jr, fresh out of retirement, relishing the chance to compete with Michael Schumacher. Speed again fails to live up to his name, and blames just about anything and anyone for his poor performances. Al realises very quickly that he's no match for Schumi, making on emotional exit after the Hungary weekend, being replaced by Bourdais. The car has good straight line speed, but has a tendency to only want to turn left. The best results come at Turkey, Singapore, and Brazil, where Bourdais manages to win. This goes completely unnoticed in the American press.

Telefonica Campos Cosworth

22 - Pedro de la Rosa
23 - Andy Soucek

Adrian Campos goes with a wholly Spanish team of de la Rosa and Soucek. The team pick up some early points as the playing field is more level, but then Soucek's performance falls off rapidly. He's unceremoniously kicked out in favour of Jaime Alguersuari just before the grand prix at Valencia, but gets Campos' cars successfully compounded in the city's "America's Cup" garages. This time though, Soucek wins an employment tribunal which gets Campos Racing a suspended 2 year ban, and Adrian Campos banned from all motorsport activities for life.

Virgin MTV Manor Cosworth

24 - Domineco Schiattarella
25 - Jos Verstappen

Nick Wirth decided to pick up where he left off with his improving Simtek team, bringing back Domineco Schiattarella and Jos Verstappen, also bringing in MTV sponsorship. However, the MTV sponsorship is pulled when Nick Wirth is interrupted by Tony Fernandes of Lotus while presenting an award at the MTV Video Awards, and Fernandes declaring that he was "going to let Nick finish, but Pacific were the greatest 90s backmarkers of all time...OF ALL TIME". Despite the car being reminisent of F3 vehicles, and sounding like they are only running on 6 cylinders, Manor build on a slow start to the season (Jos was engulfed in flames during the team's first pitstop at Bahrain), and score points, with Mimmo earning a popular victory in front of the Tifosi at Monza. Mimmo earns a move to Ferrari for 2010 and plays out the rest of his career there.

VisitMalaysia Lotus Proton

26 - Bruno Senna
27 - Fairuz Fauzy

Lotus couldn't resist the publicity of teaming up with Bruno Senna, whilst Fauzy outbid Alex Yoong for the number 2 seat. The team prove to be innovative in the design department, employing suspect undercar aerodynamic "ground-effect" parts. However, before these can be banned it was found that these parts had an adverse effect and both cars took off into the sky, ala Le-Mans Mercedes, going down the long back straight in Malaysia. Neither driver does anything else of note for the rest of the season, except for at Japan where Senna inexplicably rams Grjn off the road at the first corner of Suzuka, mistaking him for Alain Prost. This starts a famous F1 rivalry as the drivers frequently get into fistfights when collided after battling for 22nd and 23rd places.

Petronas Qadbak-Sauber Ferrari

28 - Jean-Denis Deletraz
29 - Andreas Zuber

Qadbak employs drivers to reflect their Swiss-Arab identity, bringing in legendary Swiss driver Deletraz, and UAE passport holder Zuber. Zuber brings in the crowds at Bahrain, but leaves the team after just one race, ala Sol Campbell, complaining that the team should have been able to attract better talent than Deletraz. He is replaced by Chanoch Nissany, in a bid to build Israeli-Arab relations, but he is thrashed by Deletraz and the disgrace brought to the team is enough to see fighting in Palestine erupt again. Deletraz himself is involved in a huge accident in Germany, which sees the Swiss government ban all of their citizens from driving, and plant fields over all of their roads. Heidfeld dependably fills in for the rest of the season.

Maestro Stefan GP Life

30 - HWNSNBM
31 - Ricardo Rosset

Stefan GP turn up at Bahrain with their 1997 Lola chasses, and Life W12 engines, and Rosset is employed to help familiarise the team with the car, whilst HWNSNBM is brought in for sponsorship. The moment that Rosset drove the Stefan GP out of the pitlane for the first time in practice 1, Stefan GP were charged with bringing the sport into disrepute, and Bernd Maylander was sent out in the Safety Car to intercept Rosset. Rosset was caught by Maylander by the 3rd corner and that was as far as Stefan GP got for the season.

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 03 Oct 2009, 14:15

watka wrote:*snip*

That would be the greatest thing that has ever happened.

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 03 Oct 2009, 14:16

Have you read the Uncyclopedia F1 page, watka?

watka · Post by **watka** » 03 Oct 2009, 14:18

Captain Hammer wrote:Have you read the Uncyclopedia F1 page, watka?

Cheers Captain, this is an awesome website.

Popi_Larrauri · Post by **Popi_Larrauri** » 03 Oct 2009, 14:41

watka wrote:You're all wrong.

Please! Post of the Month award now!

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 03 Oct 2009, 14:50

watka wrote:
Captain Hammer wrote:Have you read the Uncyclopedia F1 page, watka?

Cheers Captain, this is an awesome website.

Thank you. I wrote most of that article myself. Just updated it, actually. It was lacking in funny.

tristan1117 · Post by **tristan1117** » 03 Oct 2009, 15:17

Captain Hammer wrote:
watka wrote:
Captain Hammer wrote:Have you read the Uncyclopedia F1 page, watka?

Cheers Captain, this is an awesome website.

Thank you. I wrote most of that article myself. Just updated it, actually. It was lacking in funny.

Its not lacking in funny any more.

Nin13 · Post by **Nin13** » 03 Oct 2009, 15:33

Latest news is that Toyota have not yet confirmed Glock and Trulli only because they are negotiating for Raikkonen and Kubica.
So things can go differently now.

Kubica will prefer Toyota over Renault mainly because of all reputation damage that Renault have good through for last few months.
And indeed Mclaren may not be interested in guy like Raikkonen because that would form potentially destructive pairing with Hamilton.

So we might see Raikkonen and Kubica in Toyota. Now this will surely be better for most unpopular team in F1 paddock, getting some popular guys in.

This means Rosberg will move to Mclaren.

Now at Williams- Rubens and Heidfeld are negotiating to partner Hulkenberg.

Renault are also looking to Heidfeld to partner Grosjean. Because with Alonso gone experienced guy is surely needed, especially with refuelling ban. So if Williams take Heidfeld, they may revert to ex-driver Trulli.

Brawn are not interested in rookie, as Ross Brawn have already mentioned. They were looking for Button and Rosberg to be partners. But may have to keep Barichello. Barichello's experience will be huge next year, being only guy to have driven with 150 kgs fuel in car in his pre 1993 career.

BTW Luca Di Montezomelo is such an idiot. He works on Enzo Ferrari's principle that drivers are just workers in team to be replaced like Napkins!!
Michael Schumacher ticked at Ferrari only because he knew, without him Ferrari was nothing especially in post 1995 era.

Now that Ferrari is superior to any team, he has got is old principles back again.

Such a shame Michael was Mercedes development drivers. History would have been different if Mclaren had signed him when he was leaving Benneton.

shinji · Post by **shinji** » 03 Oct 2009, 16:13

watka - if only all that were to happen, if only.

Yannick · Post by **Yannick** » 03 Oct 2009, 16:45

Zuber to Qadbak / Sauber is actually a nice and realistic idea.

Too bad they don't have an entry yet.
And Williams don't look like they are going to allow them in. Remember ... BMW left them for Sauber back in the day.

Jordan192 · Post by **Jordan192** » 05 Oct 2009, 11:02

Raikkonen only interested in winning car

It could be bluff, but that doesn't exactly scream "Why yes, I'd love to drive for a team that's consistently underperformed for a decade, and will be getting its budget slashed for next year"

Yannick · Post by **Yannick** » 05 Oct 2009, 20:13

In case Button were refused his raise at Brawn, he might take the #1 elsewhere. That could be Toyota. With Barrichello off to Williams, who would then partner Rosberg at Brawn? Somebody who brings money (Petrov?) Somebody who brings publicity (Senna?) Somebody who the team know well (Davidson, Sato?)

And who will partner Fairuz Fauzy at Proton, erm, I mean Lotus?

I guess Bourdais to USF1 partnered by "US F1 Idol" would make some sense.

And when it comes to engines, Cosworth are allowed to upgrade theirs. Now if this is the best power plant next year, Williams could try to win the championship - and the new teams could escape eligibility to the site rather sooner than later.

Pacifics only fan · Post by **Pacifics only fan** » 05 Oct 2009, 20:34

If Raikonnen wants a winning car, then Brawn would surely be an attractive option should Button go elsewhere. Raikonnen and Rosberg would make a VERY formidable pairing, not just talent wise, but also it's about time Rosberg had a teammate who can help him take his game to the next level.

Waris · Post by **Waris** » 05 Oct 2009, 20:57

watka wrote:
[post of the month]

I had a good laugh reading that, thnaks. :lol:

Ulfuls · Post by **Ulfuls** » 05 Oct 2009, 20:59

Yannick wrote:I guess Bourdais to USF1 partnered by "US F1 Idol" would make some sense.

Although if Villeneuve was really refused a look-in at USF1 because he isn't American enough, and not, say, because somebody thought he was a stroppy git, what chance does cheese-eating surrender monkey S. Bourdais have?

If USF1 ever gets as far as signing drivers, which I'm still not convinced they will, I'm sure they'll go for the most red-meat-eating, baccy-chewing ex-NASCAR good ol boy they can find. If there are any of those who can be relied upon to pilot a highly-strung single-seater for more than a lap at a time without, as we now say in these parts, "doing a Toro Rosso".

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 05 Oct 2009, 21:02

Pacifics only fan wrote:If Raikonnen wants a winning car, then Brawn would surely be an attractive option should Button go elsewhere. Raikonnen and Rosberg would make a VERY formidable pairing, not just talent wise, but also it's about time Rosberg had a teammate who can help him take his game to the next level.

I was thinking exactly the same. I wonder of Brawn would have the bottle to dump Button after he won the Championship? Sort of Williams dumping Mansell and Hill.

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 05 Oct 2009, 21:05

Ulfuls wrote:If USF1 ever gets as far as signing drivers, which I'm still not convinced they will, I'm sure they'll go for the most red-meat-eating, baccy-chewing ex-NASCAR good ol boy they can find. If there are any of those who can be relied upon to pilot a highly-strung single-seater for more than a lap at a time without, as we now say in these parts, "doing a Toro Rosso".

I think the only NASCAR drivers really capable of hacking it in F1 are Jeff Gordon and Tony Stewart. And they're both too old now.

Pacifics only fan · Post by **Pacifics only fan** » 05 Oct 2009, 21:08

Tony Stewart has also just got involved in running his own team too, so it looks like he would stay put. But here's one, what about Jimmie Johnson?

Waris · Post by **Waris** » 05 Oct 2009, 21:29

Jimmy Vasser. XD That would be hilarious. If they're going to sign someone who's going to be extremely rejectworthy* anyway, then they might just as well sign Jimmy Vasser.

*Note how I use "rejectworthy" instead of my usual "fail" in keeping with this forum's style.

dragonsteincole · Post by **dragonsteincole** » 05 Oct 2009, 22:55

Via Twitter

"Renault is set to confirm Robert Kubica at 10am tomorrow morning UK time - so check out autosport.com for more details then."
From noblef1 (autosport guy), so going to be on the money i reckon.

All ze pieces are falling into place... for some reason an evil laugh would be appropriate here.

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 06 Oct 2009, 09:20

dragonsteincole wrote:Via Twitter

"Renault is set to confirm Robert Kubica at 10am tomorrow morning UK time - so check out autosport.com for more details then."
From noblef1 (autosport guy), so going to be on the money i reckon.

All ze pieces are falling into place... for some reason an evil laugh would be appropriate here.

This just in from Jon Noble (noblef1)
"There are suggestions that the Renault-Kubica announcement has been delayed for unspecified reasons. It may be later today or even tomorrow"

Anything to read into that under the surface?

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 06 Oct 2009, 10:15

Wizzie wrote:
dragonsteincole wrote:Via Twitter

"Renault is set to confirm Robert Kubica at 10am tomorrow morning UK time - so check out autosport.com for more details then."
From noblef1 (autosport guy), so going to be on the money i reckon.

All ze pieces are falling into place... for some reason an evil laugh would be appropriate here.

This just in from Jon Noble (noblef1)
"There are suggestions that the Renault-Kubica announcement has been delayed for unspecified reasons. It may be later today or even tomorrow"

Anything to read into that under the surface?

I'd like to believe Robert was tempted by Toyota actually doshing it out. Still believe Toyota is better than Renault.

Or... Kubica to McLaren?

Yannick · Post by **Yannick** » 06 Oct 2009, 15:19

Robert Doornbos used to be the most recent pay driver of sorts. Maybe ING might bring hm back, but not to Renault obviously?

There are quotes from Bernie being passed around on the web that 2 teams might not make it onto the grid, one because of a lack of money and the other because the car might not be ready yet.

People on the message boards across the web are guessing the former might be the customer of Dallara and the latter might be the Charlotte-based outfit.

Couldn't the team with the latter problem just buy their car from Lola for the first season?

Ulfuls · Post by **Ulfuls** » 06 Oct 2009, 15:38

Yannick wrote:...There are quotes from Bernie being passed around on the web that 2 teams might not make it onto the grid, one because of a lack of money and the other because the car might not be ready yet.

People on the message boards across the web are guessing the former might be the customer of Dallara and the latter might be the Charlotte-based outfit.

Couldn't the team with the latter problem just buy their car from Lola for the first season?

Well, given that USF1 have been making a lot of rather annoying hay out of being a different kind of constructor, having their factory open to their many fans, bring NASCAR know-how to the F1 specification, etc etc etc, it would be rather embarrassing for them to throw up their hands, admit that they were incapable of getting the job done, and have the team based in East Anglia rather than North Carolina. EAF1! I think I know where Chad Hurley's money would be going in that case, as well.

I wonder what the latest date someone could commit to the Lola chassis is? Presumably the design work has continued to tick along, and you would think they have the manufacturing capability to churn out three or four chassis on fairly short notice -- enough to get a team up and running, anyway.

Debaser · Post by **Debaser** » 06 Oct 2009, 16:17

I read somewhere the one team unlikely to make the grid will be USF1, as apparently they've barely started building the car and are waiting for certain parts to arrive. Pretty big climbdown eh???

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 06 Oct 2009, 21:50

I think Bernie's just being all doom and gloom. I read an article from the New York Times about the formation and development of USF1, and from the sounds of things, it was all systems go. A lot of people seem to thinktht they're some kind of scam or big public relations stunt, but I doubt you could convince people like Chad Hurley to part with their hard-earned that easily. The article went on to suggest that Bernie didn't actually believe what he was saying, and was simply giving voice to mutterings in the paddock.

Ulfuls · Post by **Ulfuls** » 07 Oct 2009, 02:01

Captain Hammer wrote:I think Bernie's just being all doom and gloom. I read an article from the New York Times about the formation and development of USF1, and from the sounds of things, it was all systems go. A lot of people seem to thinktht they're some kind of scam or big public relations stunt, but I doubt you could convince people like Chad Hurley to part with their hard-earned that easily. The article went on to suggest that Bernie didn't actually believe what he was saying, and was simply giving voice to mutterings in the paddock.

I don't think they're a scam or a stunt, but I do think they're naive, overconfident, and underestimating the troubles they are going to face doing the following:

(a) designing the car -- a modern F1 car is not the same as a NASCAR vehicle, and it helps if you're familiar with the idiom. All the CFD power in the world is not going to help you if you're just trying to put slippy bodywork on a NASCAR chassis.

(b) manufacturing the car -- they are apparently just getting the first of their manufacturing equipment together now. That leaves them five months at the very very latest to get everything they need together, get it installed, get it working properly, get people who know how to use it, and manufacture at least one complete chassis to F1 standards. And that's if their entirely new car designed by inexperienced mechanics doesn't turn a wheel until 1 March.

(c) finding the drivers -- they seem to be determined to use Americans. I would suggest that even the most skilled, intelligent, and adaptable Indycar or NASCAR drivers are going to face a very very steep learning curve in F1 machinery -- even the version produced by USF1.

(d) finding the employees -- Virgin and Lotus are based in the UK where there is an established pool of F1 and other formulae single-seater mechanics and personnel to draw from. Campos is based in Spain where there may not be the F1 talent pool, but there are mechanics who have worked on similar machinery in GP2, WSR, &c. Not a lot of single-seater experience in North Carolina. Experience counts.

(e) developing the car -- even if they do manage to create something that fits the regulations and goes forward, left and right, how are they going to develop it. Even among experienced F1 pilots there are some who are lousy at giving their engineers the feedback needed to develop the car. How is a NASCAR driver supposed to know what he's feeling from the car, let alone how to make it better?

(f) operating the team -- Michael Andretti provided the object lesson in what happens when you try to compete in F1 while basing yourself in North America. Even Cologne and Hinwil are a little far away from the nerve centres in Italy and England -- North Carolina is just preposterous. Just the money they will spend shipping everything across the Atlantic for every race will probably bankrupt them.

Youtube may get a great documentary out of this -- but it and USF1 are not going to get a racing car.

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 07 Oct 2009, 05:20

Ulfuls wrote:(a) designing the car -- a modern F1 car is not the same as a NASCAR vehicle, and it helps if you're familiar with the idiom. All the CFD power in the world is not going to help you if you're just trying to put slippy bodywork on a NASCAR chassis.

Who said they're going to use a NASCAR chassis? The only reason they're in North Carolina is because it's the heart of NASCAR country, and with it are the facilities to produce racing cars. They're using a vacant NASCAR facility, but they're obviously going to retrofit it to their needs. All that computational flow dynamics does is allow them to create a chassis that doesn't really require the use of scale models and wind tunnels. And for the record, Nick Wirth and Manor are going to use CFD as well. In fact, if you know where to look online - I know there's a thread in the Autosport forums, but I don't have a link - USF1 have already relased preliminary design drawings of their car to demonstrate CFD; they did it last month.

Ulfuls wrote:(b) manufacturing the car -- they are apparently just getting the first of their manufacturing equipment together now. That leaves them five months at the very very latest to get everything they need together, get it installed, get it working properly, get people who know how to use it, and manufacture at least one complete chassis to F1 standards. And that's if their entirely new car designed by inexperienced mechanics doesn't turn a wheel until 1 March.

Their people are not totally inexperienced. No doubt they will be recruiting people from groups like IndyCar to aid in the development process. And if you don't hink they can do it in five months, I'd be having more serious reservations about the four other new teams myself because USF1 will be the first car off the production line. They intend to have a rolling chassis by the end of the month, something that Dallara haven't promised for Campos, that Nick Wirth and Manor haven't suggested and which Lotus have given no indication of. Lotus are probably the only people who can stand a chance at beating them if they go through Lola.

Ulfuls wrote:(c) finding the drivers -- they seem to be determined to use Americans. I would suggest that even the most skilled, intelligent, and adaptable Indycar or NASCAR drivers are going to face a very very steep learning curve in F1 machinery -- even the version produced by USF1.

There's more to American motorsports than just IndyCar and NASCAR. USF1 want an experienced driver for 2010, someone who can lead them forward; the names Pedro de la Rosa and Alex Wurz have been thrown about and Peter Windsor is an unashamed fan of the noe seemingly-unemployed Jarno Trulli. As for their other driver, I'm tipping Jonathan Summerton. He's a twenty-one year old kid who apparently hasn't raced on an oval in his life (at least until this year, and he's only done two races), but he's won the Formula BMW series as well as races in the Formula Three Euroseries as well as taking podiums and Team USA's first victory in A1GP, Formula Atlantic and some excellent results at St. Petersburg and Long Beach in the Firestone Indy Lights. There's your American driver.

Ulfuls wrote:(d) finding the employees -- Virgin and Lotus are based in the UK where there is an established pool of F1 and other formulae single-seater mechanics and personnel to draw from. Campos is based in Spain where there may not be the F1 talent pool, but there are mechanics who have worked on similar machinery in GP2, WSR, &c. Not a lot of single-seater experience in North Carolina. Experience counts.

Who said they're only looking at people from North Carolina? Hell, they're talking with me and I'm Australian (though I'm not in a technical capacity). USF1 aren't looking for results straight out of the box; when was the last time anyone ever won their first race other than Brawn? After all, you probably remember BAR's (ironically, a previous incarnation of Brawn) embarrassing assertation that they would win their first Grand Prix. All of the new teams probably have very humble goals for 2010 as they'll probably be limited to racing amongst themselves and with Toro Rosso. Look at Red Bull, who only scooped their maiden victory in their fifth year of competition. I think a lot of people are overestimating USF1, or ar least misinterpreting their ambitions. They want to be the premier American team, but at the same time, guys like Peter Windsor and Ken Anderson who have been in the apdock for years (if not decades) are probably under no illusions that they're not going to be competitive. Their ambitions probably don't go much further than challenging for regular points by the end of the season.

In other news, they've also convinced one of Cosworth's most senior people, Bernard Ferguson, to join their cause. And speaking of Cosworth, Is eriously doubt he claims that the engine will be so under-powered that it will be three seconds a lap slower than everything else. The FIA is pinning the future of the sport on these new teams, and there is simply no way they would let the teams use them. Nor would Cosworth for that matter; they have a name to uphold, and they're not about to go binning it with something so ridiculously bad. They'd have to know that the engine was bad well in advance, and so wouldn't be willing to distribute it. And if they did, the new teams could probably appraoch the FIA's Contract Review Board and find a way out, acquire new engines mid-season and all would be well in the world. Two other things stand out: the Cosworth engine has to be built to specifications set by the FIA. The 2006 engine - which the 2010 engine is rumours to be based on - doesn't comply with these regulations (I think it's too big). As they were originally granted a rev limit of 20,000rpm, the 2006 engine couldn't be devloped to this as it was still under an engine freeze. Cosworth's engine will likely be developed from the ground up. I believe the rumours of its abysma performace onl broke once Cosworth came out and said they had agreed to match the 18,000rpm limit imposed on the other engines.

The other thing that stands out is this: the FIA is pushing for engine equilisation using the current Renault engine as the benchmark. The Mercedes will have to be de-tuned, but I do believe that anything that doesn't match the Renault can have an upgrade swung its way to bring it up to the same level of performance. If the Cosworth is indeed the one used in 2006 - and given that it was so thoroughly abysmal, I highly doubt it - then it can be developed to be equilised.

Ulfuls wrote:(e) developing the car -- even if they do manage to create something that fits the regulations and goes forward, left and right, how are they going to develop it. Even among experienced F1 pilots there are some who are lousy at giving their engineers the feedback needed to develop the car. How is a NASCAR driver supposed to know what he's feeling from the car, let alone how to make it better?

Again, who says a NASCAR driver is a dead cert for the position? I'll point you to Summerton once again. And, likewise, their desire for an experienced Formula One driver, something that I guarantee you will be high on the shopping lists of all four teams. As de la Rosa and Wurz are the prime candidates, I'd say they'd be in good hands as both have been test drivers for years.

In terms of actually upgrading and developing the car, the rules of 2010 also state that there will only be a fixed number of upgrades that a team can use over the season. I beleve they can choose them when and where they like, but they only have a set number of them. All of the teams are going to be the same in that respect.

Ulfuls wrote:(f) operating the team -- Michael Andretti provided the object lesson in what happens when you try to compete in F1 while basing yourself in North America. Even Cologne and Hinwil are a little far away from the nerve centres in Italy and England -- North Carolina is just preposterous. Just the money they will spend shipping everything across the Atlantic for every race will probably bankrupt them.

USF1 plan to have a secondary base on the European continent; Epsilon Euskadi's facilities have been touted as the most likely place for this (and this, I believe, may be why Euskadi repeatedly failed to make the grid). That article in the New York Times about the creation of the team makes a petty strong case to suggest that USF1 can not only load their cars up and get them back to North Carolina on a budget, but that they can actually beat the European teams back to their home base in the European races, which I do not think will be flyaway races (ie, the teams have to drive).

Plus, Formula One Mangement have agreed to cover transportation costs for up to ten tonnes of equpiment for the duration of a team's debut season. I believe they may also be covering accomodation. So it's not as if USF1, Manor, Lotus and Campos are going to be dropped into the fray and expected to hit the ground running. They're getting financial help from FOM as well as technical advice and help from the FOTA teams.

Ulfuls wrote:Youtube may get a great documentary out of this -- but it and USF1 are not going to get a racing car.

Not that it matters, YouTube isn't sponsoring USF1. Chad Hurley may have created it, but he sold the company to Google and only remains invovled in an advisory capacity. No, he's an entrepeneur in the vein of Richard Branson who is putting up the money for the team to get started. If Branson can do it with manor, why can't Hurley do it with USF1?

No, as I've said before, I believe the criticism and scepticism over the team comes from the fact that they're American and has nothing to do with their credentials. I'm guessing that if you went and had a look at Manor and Campos and Lotus, you'd find your own arguments as to why theymay or may not make it. So what if they don't have facilities in North Carolina just yet? They're not going to purchase them and start producing until their rolling prototype is ready (but that doesn't mean they're building it in Windsor's garage). Its the nature of these projects that everything tends to happen at once. If you want to be concerned over a team, be concerned for Lotus, who only have six monthsto do what the other teams have been doing all year. Be concerned for Campos, who are outsourcing the development of their chassis to Dallara, and if anything goes wrong at Dallara, Campos will be the ones to suffer for it. Be concered for Manor, who have hardly said anything beyond their intend to use CFD and have Ricahrd Branson as a backer (and who will possibly buy them out and rename the team Virgin F1).

But unlike the other three new teams, USF1's destiny is completely within their own hands. Their ultimate success or failure will depend entirely on themselves, something which is to be respected and applauded rather criticsied and derided. Because I honestly do believe they can pull through and surprise their critics nd their detractors. And should they taste success - which wouldn't surprise me given that I haven't seen a single shred of evidence to support these claims other than Ecclestone's doubts (you never want to listen to him, but as soon as he says something like this, you believe him? How does that work!?) and rumourmongering on the internet (there's the suggestion that USF1 postponed a meeting with Cosworth people ... but do you believe every other team makes their cars without a single problem, assuming the alleged meeting was allegedly postponed over an alleged problem within the team?) - then I think that success will be all the more satisfying because they spit in the face of "adversity" (I use that term loosely).

People thought that after last season, Honda - and later Brawn - would be in serious trouble. Now look at them; aside from a short interval in Britain and Germany, they haven't been challenged for either title all season. I'm not saying USF1 can repeat that success, but everybody loves an underdog. Especially when they get what they deserve. I think there's going to be a lot of red-faced fans next season ...

Ulfuls · Post by **Ulfuls** » 07 Oct 2009, 11:57

Captain Hammer wrote: *lucid and rational defence of USF1*

You do make some interesting points -- Jonathan Summerton does seem more promising than many of the alternatives. I don't think I said anything about the Cosworth; I'm sure it will be perfectly adequate. I know everybody uses CFD -- but CFD alone (and wind tunnel work alone, for that matter) don't produce an adequate racing car -- as Nick Wirth may find out, you're right. And of course their mechanics and their facilities aren't going to be completely inadequate -- my point was just that the whole proposition has enough shaky bits to make me doubtful.

I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree for the time being -- let's see what happens in Bahrain!

jackanderton · Post by **jackanderton** » 07 Oct 2009, 12:37

I interpreted Bernie's negative comments more as a wake-up call to the new teams to pull their finger out and take it seriously, or not to bother. It also lowers expectations which if unfounded will give everyone a nice surprise if it works out next year, and if it doesn't work out he can say 'i told you so'. He knows his media, that bloke.

Pacifics only fan · Post by **Pacifics only fan** » 07 Oct 2009, 13:17

http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/ ... 10065.html

Kubica's off to Renault, so that's said and done. Just a question of who will partner him. Renault need to spend next year re-building their reputation, and will need to good drivers to help with that.

fjackdaw · Post by **fjackdaw** » 07 Oct 2009, 13:37

jackanderton wrote:He knows his media, that bloke.

Apart from the whole Hitler thing...

jackanderton · Post by **jackanderton** » 07 Oct 2009, 13:56

Well he is about 100 years old I suppose. Put it this way, he has a number of very strong views on things that he in general does quite well not to talk about. When it comes to F1 he is stringently on-message, which I suppose is quite easy for him at times because he is the message.

shinji · Post by **shinji** » 07 Oct 2009, 14:25

Captain Hammer wrote:Hell, they're talking with me

Really? Good luck and keep us informed.

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 07 Oct 2009, 14:46

Ulfuls wrote:
Captain Hammer wrote: *lucid and rational defence of USF1*

You do make some interesting points -- Jonathan Summerton does seem more promising than many of the alternatives. I don't think I said anything about the Cosworth; I'm sure it will be perfectly adequate. I know everybody uses CFD -- but CFD alone (and wind tunnel work alone, for that matter) don't produce an adequate racing car -- as Nick Wirth may find out, you're right. And of course their mechanics and their facilities aren't going to be completely inadequate -- my point was just that the whole proposition has enough shaky bits to make me doubtful.

I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree for the time being -- let's see what happens in Bahrain!

Yeah, I know you didn't mention Cosworth. But USF1 did get Ferguson, and that set me on a tangent that I had to see out.

And if you look at the other teams, I'm sure you'll find enough shaky bits to make you doubtful of them, too.

Ed24 · Post by **Ed24** » 07 Oct 2009, 15:54

I don't think we can even take Button for granted at Brawn in 2010, imho

Firstly, considering Button seems to be having a pay dispute with Brawn (http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/091004060737.shtml]), a big offer from Toyota or Renault could seem quite enticing for him. Button, like other candidates Trulli and Kovalainen, has previous experience driving with Renault as well. This is of course assuming he has a choice to leave.

If I was Ross Brawn, I wouldn't be that unhappy to see him go, as I think Rosberg and Glock would do a better job, if he can get them. It is impossible to say whether Button's poor performance is due to championship pressure or just a lack of speed (or both), but it would be quite worrying for Ross Brawn that Button has fallen off so badly in the 2nd half of the year, even in comparison to Rubens, and in the cut-throat world of F1, you are often only as good as your last performance. The fact that Button can't seem to get the best out of the car when their car is 3rd or 4th fastest does not bode well for 2010, when they will probably be behind McLaren and Ferrari (at least), both of which Button can't even beat now generally.

Post by **DemocalypseNow** » 07 Oct 2009, 15:58

Ed24 wrote:I don't think we can even take Button for granted at Brawn in 2010, imho

Firstly, considering Button seems to be having a pay dispute with Brawn (http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/091004060737.shtml]), a big offer from Toyota or Renault could seem quite enticing for him. Button, like other candidates Trulli and Kovalainen, has previous experience driving with Renault as well. This is of course assuming he has a choice to leave.

If I was Ross Brawn, I wouldn't be that unhappy to see him go, as I think Rosberg and Glock would do a better job, if he can get them. It is impossible to say whether Button's poor performance is due to championship pressure or just a lack of speed (or both), but it would be quite worrying for Ross Brawn that Button has fallen off so badly in the 2nd half of the year, even in comparison to Rubens, and in the cut-throat world of F1, you are often only as good as your last performance. The fact that Button can't seem to get the best out of the car when their car is 3rd or 4th fastest does not bode well for 2010, when they will probably be behind McLaren and Ferrari (at least), both of which Button can't even beat now generally.

LOST IN TRANSLATION

"We aren't being greedy"
actually means...
"We are being REALLY greedy"

Yannick · Post by **Yannick** » 10 Oct 2009, 18:04

Current silly season rumours are that Nelsinho is in talks with Campos and that Trulli is in talks with Lotus.

watka · Post by **watka** » 11 Oct 2009, 17:56

Yannick wrote:Current silly season rumours are that Nelsinho is in talks with Campos

Yannick: putting the "silly" in "silly season"

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 12 Oct 2009, 21:23

Breaking News: Barrichello to Williams.
http://wwos.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=874894