Azerbaijan!!!

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 30 Apr 2014, 16:58

Next year's European Grand Prix... I wanna say it has as much chance of actually happening as the New Jersey race?

Wallio · Post by **Wallio** » 30 Apr 2014, 17:22

Forgive my ignorance, but is Azerbaijan actually in Europe? Is it an EU member?

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 30 Apr 2014, 17:29

Wallio wrote:Forgive my ignorance, but is Azerbaijan actually in Europe? Is it an EU member?

It is not an EU member and it is placed in what is considered the border between Europe and western Asia. They certainly prefer to consider themselves European. So do they neighbours Armenia and Georgia. Not Iran, mind you!

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 30 Apr 2014, 17:30

Wallio wrote:Forgive my ignorance, but is Azerbaijan actually in Europe? Is it an EU member?

Definitely not an EU member. In my book, it's Eurasian, but officially it apparently is Europe... Further east than Turkey, so quite possibly a flyaway race!

shinji · Post by **shinji** » 30 Apr 2014, 17:35

Why couldn't it just be the Azerbaijani Grand Prix? Not like Valencia and Nurburgring where there was another race in the same country.

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 30 Apr 2014, 17:37

It falls into a bit of a grey area really. The Caucasus region is quite isolated from the rest of Asia and can't really be considered part of the Middle East, but theoretically it is in Asia. The fact is, because the countries are former Soviet states, they have almost been "adopted" by Europe. Whether this is out of sympathy, to get more teams qualifying for the European Football Championships, or to give us more varied voting options on Eurovision I don't know.

Really it should be the Azerbaijan Grand Prix, but I'm guessing the country's officials are that proud of their country's heritage that they'd rather not use their own name and commandeer something else!

Wallio · Post by **Wallio** » 30 Apr 2014, 17:40

shinji wrote:Why couldn't it just be the Azerbaijani Grand Prix? Not like Valencia and Nurburgring where there was another race in the same country.

This was my confusion. To me the European GP is be in "hardline" Europe (and should rotate, but that's another story). Knowing its by Georgia makes a bit more sense, but it still seems a reach to me.

Nessafox · Post by **Nessafox** » 30 Apr 2014, 17:49

From the 3 Caucasean countries, only Georgia is officially part of the European subcontinent. But because all 3 countries used to be part of the Soviet-union and became independent at the same time, they're all considered European.
Mind you that some other countries like Iceland and Malta are also on the border between two continents, and that Cyprus is technically 100% Asian, but is also considered to be European, because of their culture.
That is discounting the United Kingdom and France with their overseas territories, and Denmark, which is mostly on the American continent (Greenland), so Europe is usually a cultural thing.
Still that doesn't give Isreal the right to win the Eurovision Song contest in my opinion, but that's an antirely different debate.

About the GP itselfs, well, it looks like the Azerbeidjani government loves to spend money, and usually they get their big projects finished on schedule, so i looks realistic.

roblo97 · Post by **roblo97** » 30 Apr 2014, 18:00

Wallio wrote:
shinji wrote:Why couldn't it just be the Azerbaijani Grand Prix? Not like Valencia and Nurburgring where there was another race in the same country.

This was my confusion. To me the European GP is be in "hardline" Europe (and should rotate, but that's another story). Knowing its by Georgia makes a bit more sense, but it still seems a reach to me.

To me, Europe should have a time difference of -1 hour to +2.5 hours from UK time. Azerbaijan is something like +4 hours.

Barbazza · Post by **Barbazza** » 30 Apr 2014, 19:10

They compete in the Eurovision song contest of course. And won it the other year, which meant that the contest in Baku went on past midnight their time to fit in with TV schedules in the rest of Europe!

roblo97 · Post by **roblo97** » 30 Apr 2014, 19:28

Barbazza wrote:They compete in the Eurovision song contest of course. And won it the other year, which meant that the contest in Baku went on past midnight their time to fit in with TV schedules in the rest of Europe!

IIRC, I think it started at midnight local time :shock:

GwilymJJames · Post by **GwilymJJames** » 30 Apr 2014, 20:51

Barbazza wrote:They compete in the Eurovision song contest of course. And won it the other year, which meant that the contest in Baku went on past midnight their time to fit in with TV schedules in the rest of Europe!

Eurovision is different from Europe, mind. Morocco have entered Eurovision.

And we can't trust football. Football thinks Australia is in Asia.

Barbazza · Post by **Barbazza** » 30 Apr 2014, 21:21

GwilymJJames wrote:Eurovision is different from Europe, mind. Morocco have entered Eurovision.

Oh, I know that. I'm a huge Eurovision fan, for my sins. To be in Eurovision, you just need to be a member of the EBU!

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 30 Apr 2014, 21:22

roblomas52 wrote:To me, Europe should have a time difference of -1 hour to +2.5 hours from UK time. Azerbaijan is something like +4 hours.

So most of Africa is European? Way to go, RoBloMas52!

Nessafox · Post by **Nessafox** » 30 Apr 2014, 21:32

dr-baker wrote:
roblomas52 wrote:To me, Europe should have a time difference of -1 hour to +2.5 hours from UK time. Azerbaijan is something like +4 hours.

So most of Africa is European? Way to go, RoBloMas52!

Everyone knows Africa is only a Roman province? (just like for example Asia, or Brittania)

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 30 Apr 2014, 21:45

This wrote:
dr-baker wrote:
roblomas52 wrote:To me, Europe should have a time difference of -1 hour to +2.5 hours from UK time. Azerbaijan is something like +4 hours.

So most of Africa is European? Way to go, RoBloMas52!

Everyone knows Africa is only a Roman province? (just like for example Asia, or Brittania)

Oh Gordon Bennett, I feel a massive can of worms being opened here...

roblo97 · Post by **roblo97** » 30 Apr 2014, 21:47

dr-baker wrote:
roblomas52 wrote:To me, Europe should have a time difference of -1 hour to +2.5 hours from UK time. Azerbaijan is something like +4 hours.

So most of Africa is European? Way to go, RoBloMas52!

I was refering to the continent of Europe and where I think the cut off lines should be. Infact I will make what I think Europe is tomorrow on gmaps pedometer.

shinji · Post by **shinji** » 30 Apr 2014, 21:55

roblomas52 wrote:
dr-baker wrote:
roblomas52 wrote:To me, Europe should have a time difference of -1 hour to +2.5 hours from UK time. Azerbaijan is something like +4 hours.

So most of Africa is European? Way to go, RoBloMas52!

I was refering to the continent of Europe and where I think the cut off lines should be. Infact I will make what I think Europe is tomorrow on gmaps pedometer.

Bit UKIPpy there with your arbitrary limitations on who gets to identify themselves as a particular nationality, or what states can see themselves as a part of a fluid geographical concept Robby lad!

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 30 Apr 2014, 21:58

roblomas52 wrote:
dr-baker wrote:
roblomas52 wrote:To me, Europe should have a time difference of -1 hour to +2.5 hours from UK time. Azerbaijan is something like +4 hours.

So most of Africa is European? Way to go, RoBloMas52!

I was refering to the continent of Europe and where I think the cut off lines should be. Infact I will make what I think Europe is tomorrow on gmaps pedometer.

What you think is Europe counts for absolutely nothing. Hell, the actual definition of Europe counts for nothing. If the FIA decide Azerbaijan can have the European GP designation, that's that. It's not like it really matters either way what the race is called - we'll still be going to a brand new track in a country with no motorsport heritage.

Post by **Ataxia** » 30 Apr 2014, 22:07

Salamander wrote:
roblomas52 wrote:
dr-baker wrote:So most of Africa is European? Way to go, RoBloMas52!

I was refering to the continent of Europe and where I think the cut off lines should be. Infact I will make what I think Europe is tomorrow on gmaps pedometer.

What you think is Europe counts for absolutely nothing. Hell, the actual definition of Europe counts for nothing. If the FIA decide Azerbaijan can have the European GP designation, that's that. It's not like it really matters either way what the race is called - we'll still be going to a brand new track in a country with no motorsport heritage.

Well, now Azerbaijan has the chance to develop its own motorsport heritage. [/positivespin]

RonDenisDeletraz · Post by **RonDenisDeletraz** » 30 Apr 2014, 22:29

This could be properly interesting, I can see it happening because the country has money. (Eurovision, the GT race)

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 30 Apr 2014, 22:34

Ataxia wrote:
Salamander wrote:What you think is Europe counts for absolutely nothing. Hell, the actual definition of Europe counts for nothing. If the FIA decide Azerbaijan can have the European GP designation, that's that. It's not like it really matters either way what the race is called - we'll still be going to a brand new track in a country with no motorsport heritage.

Well, now Azerbaijan has the chance to develop its own motorsport heritage. [/positivespin]

Oh certainly. I was just stating a fact there, there's nothing concrete to say it won't be a good addition to the calendar.

watka · Post by **watka** » 01 May 2014, 22:33

According to the FIA, the Nurburgring is a famous track in Luxembourg.

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 01 May 2014, 23:32

watka wrote:According to the FIA, the Nurburgring is a famous track in Luxembourg.

I'm just going to have to sig that. Perfect explaination as to why the FIA should think things out a little better.

Post by **Ataxia** » 01 May 2014, 23:57

go_Rubens wrote:
watka wrote:According to the FIA, the Nurburgring is a famous track in Luxembourg.

I'm just going to have to sig that. Perfect explaination as to why the FIA should think things out a little better.

You say that, but what were they supposed to call it? Jerez had the European name in '97, and Hockenheim had the German title annexed.

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 02 May 2014, 00:04

Ataxia wrote:
go_Rubens wrote:
watka wrote:According to the FIA, the Nurburgring is a famous track in Luxembourg.

I'm just going to have to sig that. Perfect explaination as to why the FIA should think things out a little better.

You say that, but what were they supposed to call it? Jerez had the European name in '97, and Hockenheim had the German title annexed.

They could have thought out the calendar a bit better. I didn't see the point in having the season finale at Jérez.

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 02 May 2014, 00:09

Ataxia wrote:
go_Rubens wrote:
watka wrote:According to the FIA, the Nurburgring is a famous track in Luxembourg.

I'm just going to have to sig that. Perfect explaination as to why the FIA should think things out a little better.

You say that, but what were they supposed to call it? Jerez had the European name in '97, and Hockenheim had the German title annexed.

The Rhineland-Palatinate Grand Prix. Not clunky at all.

Post by **Ataxia** » 02 May 2014, 01:14

go_Rubens wrote:
Ataxia wrote:
go_Rubens wrote:

I'm just going to have to sig that. Perfect explaination as to why the FIA should think things out a little better.

You say that, but what were they supposed to call it? Jerez had the European name in '97, and Hockenheim had the German title annexed.

They could have thought out the calendar a bit better. I didn't see the point in having the season finale at Jérez.

Oh? So because YOU didn't see the point means that FIA unquestionably made a mistake with the calendar. Well, that settles it then.

Sure, it was a bit out of place in terms of logistics, but if you've seen the race Jerez produced a fine season finale. I don't really see what your point is, since the discussion began about the name the race at the Nurburgring was given rather than when and where things were.

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 02 May 2014, 01:33

Ataxia wrote:Oh? So because YOU didn't see the point means that FIA unquestionably made a mistake with the calendar. Well, that settles it then.

Sure, it was a bit out of place in terms of logistics, but if you've seen the race Jerez produced a fine season finale. I don't really see what your point is, since the discussion began about the name the race at the Nurburgring was given rather than when and where things were.

I like to think of it as the FIA shouldn't have had 2 races in Germany, 2 in Italy, and 2 in Spain all in a 17 race season. That's nearly 3/8 of the season in 3 countries alone. Why? I'm sure there wasn't a need for being that centralized in Europe. There were likely other great tracks to race on outside of those 3 countries, and all the rest of the countries F1 had races in Europe. There were probably a few tracks that could pay a fee for a race.

Jérez did produce a fine season finale. But the calendar should have been thought out better to prevent the naming thing. It just gets on my nerves to see a race where it could have been the European GP, which is fine by me, at the Nürburgring, or any other track. Instead, you could get a country with a GP with the name of a completely different country. It gets on my nerves a little bit, as it makes me a confused person, and I don't take being confused very well.

eytl · Post by **eytl** » 02 May 2014, 02:21

As I said on a previous podcast, Baku has hosted Eurovision and missed out on bidding for the Olympics, so why not a Grand Prix?

I saw a documentary last year about how the modern, advanced, rich waterfront / promenade image which Azerbaijan is trying to promote via these high-profile events hides some worrying issues beneath the surface, but perhaps that's opening the usual can of worms about sport and politics and human rights.

But anyway, I too don't see why Azerbaijan should host the European GP and not the Azerbaijani GP. But if we must have a regional name then I would suggest:

* The Grand Prix of the Caucasus
* The Caspian Grand Prix (or Caspian Sea Grand Prix)
* The "We're Only 200kms From Crazy Turkmenistan" Grand Prix

sswishbone · Post by **sswishbone** » 02 May 2014, 06:01

They'd have to be working now on the circuit to have any chance really, apparently the 1.5 mile long circuit was very last minute and is not long enough for F1, the track used for FIAGT was only grade 3 and apparently not up to standard for anything quicker than a GT3 car. So to have a chance they'll need a whole new circuit most likely. Eytl's point about the waterfront would suggest that's the plan, but if so, where's the circuit map? Even New Jersey had that and look what happened there

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 02 May 2014, 06:12

eytl wrote:As I said on a previous podcast, Baku has hosted Eurovision and missed out on bidding for the Olympics, so why not a Grand Prix?

I saw a documentary last year about how the modern, advanced, rich waterfront / promenade image which Azerbaijan is trying to promote via these high-profile events hides some worrying issues beneath the surface, but perhaps that's opening the usual can of worms about sport and politics and human rights.

But anyway, I too don't see why Azerbaijan should host the European GP and not the Azerbaijani GP. But if we must have a regional name then I would suggest:

* The Grand Prix of the Caucasus
* The Caspian Grand Prix (or Caspian Sea Grand Prix)
* The "We're Only 200kms From Crazy Turkmenistan" Grand Prix

Again, I really don't see why anyone cares what the race is called. So what if the European Grand Prix is held on the fringes of the most favourable (in this case) definition of Europe? Did anyone kick up a fuss that the San Marino Grand Prix was held in Imola all those years? Or the Luxembourg Grand Prix at Nurburgring? It really made no difference.

RonDenisDeletraz · Post by **RonDenisDeletraz** » 02 May 2014, 06:41

Salamander wrote:
eytl wrote:As I said on a previous podcast, Baku has hosted Eurovision and missed out on bidding for the Olympics, so why not a Grand Prix?

I saw a documentary last year about how the modern, advanced, rich waterfront / promenade image which Azerbaijan is trying to promote via these high-profile events hides some worrying issues beneath the surface, but perhaps that's opening the usual can of worms about sport and politics and human rights.

But anyway, I too don't see why Azerbaijan should host the European GP and not the Azerbaijani GP. But if we must have a regional name then I would suggest:

* The Grand Prix of the Caucasus
* The Caspian Grand Prix (or Caspian Sea Grand Prix)
* The "We're Only 200kms From Crazy Turkmenistan" Grand Prix

Again, I really don't see why anyone cares what the race is called. So what if the European Grand Prix is held on the fringes of the most favourable (in this case) definition of Europe? Did anyone kick up a fuss that the San Marino Grand Prix was held in Imola all those years? Or the Luxembourg Grand Prix at Nurburgring? It really made no difference.

The F1RWRS Tasman GP annoyed me immensely, so I can understand why it could be irritating to some people.

AustralianStig · Post by **AustralianStig** » 02 May 2014, 06:50

I'm not annoyed, there are much more important things in life to get annoyed about than the naming of a race

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 02 May 2014, 07:16

RonDenisDeletraz wrote:The F1RWRS Tasman GP annoyed me immensely, so I can understand why it could be irritating to some people.

Were you annoyed by the San Marino Grand Prix being in Italy and not San Marino? Were you annoyed by the Luxembourg Grand Prix being in Germany and not Luxembourg?

Ben Gilbert · Post by **Ben Gilbert** » 02 May 2014, 07:52

Salamander wrote:
RonDenisDeletraz wrote:The F1RWRS Tasman GP annoyed me immensely, so I can understand why it could be irritating to some people.

Were you annoyed by the San Marino Grand Prix being in Italy and not San Marino? Were you annoyed by the Luxembourg Grand Prix being in Germany and not Luxembourg?

Did an Italian Grand Prix also take place in Italy for every single instance of the San Marino Grand Prix? Did a German Grand Prix also take place in Germany for every single instance of the Luxembourg Grand Prix?

Will there be an Azerbaijani Grand Prix in Azerbaijan when it also hosts the European Grand Prix?

RonDenisDeletraz · Post by **RonDenisDeletraz** » 02 May 2014, 08:30

Salamander wrote:
RonDenisDeletraz wrote:The F1RWRS Tasman GP annoyed me immensely, so I can understand why it could be irritating to some people.

Were you annoyed by the San Marino Grand Prix being in Italy and not San Marino? Were you annoyed by the Luxembourg Grand Prix being in Germany and not Luxembourg?

A little bit in hindsight, but these were far less directly relevant to me

GerhardTalger · Post by **GerhardTalger** » 02 May 2014, 08:35

Let's just call it the Turkish Grand Prix for whatever sake. :lol:

But I can't see why they should name it European Grand Prix. Absolutely no reason to do so.

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 02 May 2014, 09:17

Ben Gilbert wrote:
Salamander wrote:
RonDenisDeletraz wrote:The F1RWRS Tasman GP annoyed me immensely, so I can understand why it could be irritating to some people.

Were you annoyed by the San Marino Grand Prix being in Italy and not San Marino? Were you annoyed by the Luxembourg Grand Prix being in Germany and not Luxembourg?

Did an Italian Grand Prix also take place in Italy for every single instance of the San Marino Grand Prix? Did a German Grand Prix also take place in Germany for every single instance of the Luxembourg Grand Prix?

Will there be an Azerbaijani Grand Prix in Azerbaijan when it also hosts the European Grand Prix?

No, but again, does it even matter what it's called? There are far, far, far more important things to worry about than the name of a single race.

OsellaFA1L · Post by **OsellaFA1L** » 02 May 2014, 10:01

Salamander wrote:
Ben Gilbert wrote:Did an Italian Grand Prix also take place in Italy for every single instance of the San Marino Grand Prix? Did a German Grand Prix also take place in Germany for every single instance of the Luxembourg Grand Prix?

Will there be an Azerbaijani Grand Prix in Azerbaijan when it also hosts the European Grand Prix?

No, but again, does it even matter what it's called? There are far, far, far more important things to worry about than the name of a single race.

Complaining about what the race is called may be pointless, but by that logic so is complaining about people complaining about what the race is called. And so is this post of me complaining. Either that was some Inception style shite.

Anyway, I hope they would design a new track layout, as the GT Challenge circuit looks kinda bad.