F1WRCR 1952 season - driver ratings up!

FantometteBR · Post by **FantometteBR** » 20 Apr 2013, 16:09

Still trying to figure out the question over spending and budgets, just don't want to fold before season starts

Shadaza · Post by **Shadaza** » 20 Apr 2013, 16:18

tommykl wrote:After imagining a situation in which a member is a manufacturer and decides to build two top-of-the-line chassis and engines and build 20 of each (thinking that it should be a bit of a stretch), I've decided to give the teams with the biggest budgets (Alfa and Ferrari) 1 000 000 £ to work with. Then something like 500 000 £ for works-level customer teams (like Bleu, Ultimate or ART) as well as their manufacturers (plus manufacturers like Maserati, Aston Martin, Jaguar or Phoenix), maybe 400 000£ for smaller manufacturers (say, Alta, HWM, Cooper or O.S.C.A.), 200 000£ for the bigger private teams (Hampshire, E.N.B., Claes or Redman), 100 000£ for smaller privateer teams (All-Ireland, Commesso, Erne,...) and 75 000£ for complete start-ups.

As for prize money, things are still pretty vague. The pot will consist of the entry fee plus an additional sum determined according to the historical importance of the race. 3/4 of the pot will be redistributed after the race, the rest going into a bigger pot for the end of the season. Since an entry costs 1 000£, I was thinking of giving back the 1 000£ for making the grid, 500£ for failing to qualify and nothing for failing to pre-qualify. Add to that 10£ for every percent of the race completed, then a further prize according to finishing position and which will vary according to the pot.

Thoughts?

I was a little sceptic before but I like the way this is going and you seem to have things well thought out so far.
Could travel fees be added or would they be covered by the championship? I can imagine a trip to the Americas or Australia as being a heavy dent on a team's budget.

Also with the new budget system I can imagine many of us would like some form of testing to be carried out before the first race, I would imagine during the 50's this could be simulated by non championship races? Though don't add anything you wouldn't have time or energy to commit too.

Finally, more a pedantic point, the "£" sign goes before the number e.g "£500" (even if it is read out as 500 pounds!)

Post by **tommykl** » 20 Apr 2013, 16:31

Shadaza wrote:
tommykl wrote:After imagining a situation in which a member is a manufacturer and decides to build two top-of-the-line chassis and engines and build 20 of each (thinking that it should be a bit of a stretch), I've decided to give the teams with the biggest budgets (Alfa and Ferrari) 1 000 000 £ to work with. Then something like 500 000 £ for works-level customer teams (like Bleu, Ultimate or ART) as well as their manufacturers (plus manufacturers like Maserati, Aston Martin, Jaguar or Phoenix), maybe 400 000£ for smaller manufacturers (say, Alta, HWM, Cooper or O.S.C.A.), 200 000£ for the bigger private teams (Hampshire, E.N.B., Claes or Redman), 100 000£ for smaller privateer teams (All-Ireland, Commesso, Erne,...) and 75 000£ for complete start-ups.

As for prize money, things are still pretty vague. The pot will consist of the entry fee plus an additional sum determined according to the historical importance of the race. 3/4 of the pot will be redistributed after the race, the rest going into a bigger pot for the end of the season. Since an entry costs 1 000£, I was thinking of giving back the 1 000£ for making the grid, 500£ for failing to qualify and nothing for failing to pre-qualify. Add to that 10£ for every percent of the race completed, then a further prize according to finishing position and which will vary according to the pot.

Thoughts?

I was a little sceptic before but I like the way this is going and you seem to have things well thought out so far.
Could travel fees be added or would they be covered by the championship? I can imagine a trip to the Americas or Australia as being a heavy dent on a team's budget.

Also with the new budget system I can imagine many of us would like some form of testing to be carried out before the first race, I would imagine during the 50's this could be simulated by non championship races? Though don't add anything you wouldn't have time or energy to commit too.

Finally, more a pedantic point, the "£" sign goes before the number e.g "£500" (even if it is read out as 500 pounds!)

Travel fees have already been covered before (one extra pound for every km covered by the car).

Non-championship races could be run, but I think it would be easier if I just told you the ratings. I've never had trouble giving out that kind of information before anyway

As for the "£" sign, that's just because I choose the amounts first and I'm too lazy to go back and put the sign before the amount :lol:

Finally, a small modification concerning driver performance. Instead of a drivers' PA being determined by dividing his qualifying performances in the past 10 races by ten, the number will be divided by how many races (out of the last ten) in which he has competed. That way, a driver who only drives occasionally won't be hampered by a lack of track time.

RonDenisDeletraz · Post by **RonDenisDeletraz** » 21 Apr 2013, 01:48

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU-

My team is completely screwed with only 100,000

Post by **tommykl** » 21 Apr 2013, 04:56

eurobrun wrote:FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU-

My team is completely screwed with only 100,000

It's provisional. I'm not exactly sure where your team stands. You'll probably get 200 000 instead.

Post by **Nuppiz** » 21 Apr 2013, 09:50

I'm fine with getting £100,000, it should be enough for us to buy a HWM and make it to some of the European races close to our home.

pi314159 · Post by **pi314159** » 21 Apr 2013, 09:52

I'm fine with 400.000 for O.S.C.A. this should be enough to produce a good car for Bonetto and make it to the European races.

pasta_maldonado · Post by **pasta_maldonado** » 21 Apr 2013, 09:56

How much would BBRM get out of this?

Post by **tommykl** » 21 Apr 2013, 10:02

pasta_maldonado wrote:How much would BBRM get out of this?

Not completely sure on the budgets, but I believe 300 000 is a good sum. Maybe 400 000.

Nessafox · Post by **Nessafox** » 22 Apr 2013, 01:04

200000, well, looks workable. Thankfully the team is based in Francorchamps and the Nürbürgring is near, so that's 2 races with nearly no travel costs.
About the travel costs: what if i buy an American car for the American race only, like for example Charles Van Acker (who has a Belgian passport but lives in the States) wants to do a one-off entry like i did this year?
Sure there would be some minor costs from flying over mechanics (because with different mechanics it would just be a different team), but the car was never actually transported from the team's base in Belgium to the States and will not be flewn back. (let's say the car is privately owned by Charles, which means i will still have to pay the purchase of the car) I'm retiring him after this year, but still, by pointing out potential loopholes and discussion points, i make sure the other teams don't get any unfair advantage over me

Post by **tommykl** » 22 Apr 2013, 04:58

This wrote:200000, well, looks workable. Thankfully the team is based in Francorchamps and the Nürbürgring is near, so that's 2 races with nearly no travel costs.
About the travel costs: what if i buy an American car for the American race only, like for example Charles Van Acker (who has a Belgian passport but lives in the States) wants to do a one-off entry like i did this year?
Sure there would be some minor costs from flying over mechanics (because with different mechanics it would just be a different team), but the car was never actually transported from the team's base in Belgium to the States and will not be flewn back. (let's say the car is privately owned by Charles, which means i will still have to pay the purchase of the car) I'm retiring him after this year, but still, by pointing out potential loopholes and discussion points, i make sure the other teams don't get any unfair advantage over me

That is a good point, but I won't close that loophole, since that would be pretty expensive anyway, and the car would still have to be flown from the point of manufacture to the owner.

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 22 Apr 2013, 05:38

So both Jaguar and Aston Martin get 500 000 each, correct? Sounds like an amount I can work with as an engine supplier

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 22 Apr 2013, 11:36

Alfa Romeo announces that it will take part on another F1WRCR season. Drivers to be announced!

Post by **tommykl** » 22 Apr 2013, 15:10

The Lukas has failed to reply to my e-mail, so Bettenhausen will drive for JAMR, with the Maserati driven by Claes, who was originally supposed to sit out the race.

Post by **tommykl** » 23 Apr 2013, 16:36

October 4th 1952, United States Grand Prix qualifying

For the first time ever, Formula One heads to the new airfield circuit in Sebring, Florida. The United States Grand Prix replaces the Indianapolis 500 on the schedule, although drivers could and did take part in the classic anyway. Troy Ruttman won that race for the second year in succession, then showed that success in Europe was also possible by scoring a thrilling victory in the Dutch Grand Prix ahead of fellow American Tony Bettenhausen.

Both are also present for their home race, but the focus will be on the championship fight, which is by no means over yet. Giuseppe Farina still leads by the smallest of margins from B. Bira, with Robert Manzon, Reg Parnell, Alberto Ascari and Juan Manuel Fangio in reasonable contention, although the entire top fifteen in the championship is still theoretically capable of stealing the championship!

With a grid capable of hosting 30, and with 29 drivers making the long trip, no drivers will fail to qualify for the first time since Germany last year. It also means that some of the braver smaller teams that decided to hop over the pond stand a reasonable chance at earning some prize money.

1. B. Bira (Motorsport Bleu)
2. John Fitch (Motorsport Bleu)
3. Louis Chiron (Scuderia Commesso)
4. Toulo de Graffenried (Scuderia Ferrari)
5. Dorino Serafini (Scuderia Ferrari)
6. Reg Parnell (Scuderia Ferrari)
7. Robert Manzon (Alexander Racing Team)
8. Consalvo Sanesi (Alexander Racing Team)
9. Lance Macklin (Claes Racing Developments)
10. Johnny Claes (Claes Racing Developments)
11. Harry Schell (Ferrari America)
12. Troy Ruttman (Ferrari America)
14. José Froilan Gonzalez (Jaguar - Aston Martin Racing)
15. Piero Taruffi (Jaguar - Aston Martin Racing)
16. Edgar Barth (Team Ultimate)
17. Maurice Trintignant (Officine Alfieri Maserati)
18. Charles Van Acker (Ecurie Nationale Belge)
19. Nello Pagani (Redman Racing Team)
20. Giovanni Bracco (Scuderia Ambrosiana)
21. Porfirio Rubirosa (Scuderia Ambrosiana)
22. Maria Teresa de Filippis (Privateer)
23. Giuseppe Farina (Alfa Romeo SpA)
24. Juan Manuel Fangio (Alfa Romeo SpA)
25. Stirling Moss (Alfa Romeo SpA)
26. Alberto Ascari (Phoenix Racing Organisation)
27. Mike Hawthorn (British Bentley Racing Motors)
28. Geoff Richardson (British Bentley Racing Motors)
29. Roy Salvadori (British Bentley Racing Motors)
30. Tony Bettenhausen (Jaguar - Aston Martin Racing)

-All-Ireland Motorsport's season is over, after a year that was certainly better than 1951. They should be back in 1953.
-Due to the cost of transporting the cars, Motorsport Bleu have reverted to running two cars for the final races. Bira will of course be one of the drivers, with John Fitch being the local driver who will take part this time.
-Due to Reg Parnell suddenly being in title contention, Ferrari have decided to momentarily scrap the driver rotation and give Reg the car for the final two races in order to keep their title hopes alive. Toulo's victory, meanwhile, meant that he kept his seat and will also avoid eventual pre-qualifying session in Australia.
-David Hampshire has also ended his season after Italy. After scoring his first top tens in a still-uncompetitive Alta, he hopes to return better than ever in 1953 with HWMs.
-Harry Schell returns to Ferrari America for his home race. The American has been consistent this season, scoring five points and marking himself down as a man to watch.
-Tony Bettenhausen's recent success means that JAMR have entered him for the remaining races, causing a bit of a stir, as Tony was originally entered at Sebring by Johnny Claes. The Belgian let Bettenhausen go out of good faith and decided to hop into the cockpit once more.
-Scuderia Aqua have also finished their very disappointing season, with Piero Carini having failed to even pre-qualify in either of his two attempts.
-Officine Alfieri Maserati's season could have gone better, to say the least. With 10 failures to make the grid in 14 attempts and a single finish, Maurice Trintignant has been hired for this race to bring the team back towards the front.
-Scuderia Maremmana will again skip this race, preferring to send the three cars straight to Leyburn instead.
-Ecurie Nationale Belge will also not attend this race physically, but will still be represented by local Belgian Charles Van Acker, who will drive his own Kurtis-Kraft-Offenhauser under his national banner one last time before retiring from European racing once and for all.
-Scuderia Ambrosiana's home race turned out to be a disaster, with Bracco's seventh place nothing short of a miracle. A good finish at Sebring is what they need.
-O.S.C.A.'s season is also over, but de Filippis is still present in her own Alfa Romeo, being the main attraction for the average American spectator.
-After having spotted the short entry list, British Bentley Racing Motors quickly decided to field all three of their drivers to finally have a chance at some good results. Richardson, Hawthorn and Salvadori will all be hoping for a good, clean race.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 24 Apr 2013, 10:20

Gazzetta dello sport (translated) wrote:Straight swap between Fangio and Serafini?

News emerged yesterday, right after the announce of the entry list to this years first US Grand Prix that, following a fallout between Fangio and Farina at Alfa Romeo, with both not exchanging a single word during the whole Italian GP, that Fangio would be wanting to continue his racing career elsewhere. And what better place would that be than at Ferrari? Certainly Mr Ferrari already shown his admiration for the great Argentinian skills and it would also be an easy way out for Alfa Romeo after the last couple of race troubles. The word is that both Mr Colombo and Mr Ferrari were in talks after the Italian GP, after Fangio insistence, and we believe they are close to agreeing a swap between both proven top race winning drivers, Fangio and Serafini.

the Masked Lapwing · Post by **the Masked Lapwing** » 24 Apr 2013, 12:27

Gazzetta dello sport (translated) wrote:Straight swap between Fangio and Serafini?

News emerged yesterday, right after the announce of the entry list to this years first US Grand Prix that, following a fallout between Fangio and Farina at Alfa Romeo, with both not exchanging a single word during the whole Italian GP, that Fangio would be wanting to continue his racing career elsewhere. And what better place would that be than at Ferrari? Certainly Mr Ferrari already shown his admiration for the great Argentinian skills and it would also be an easy way out for Alfa Romeo after the last couple of race troubles. The word is that both Mr Colombo and Mr Ferrari were in talks after the Italian GP, after Fangio insistence, and we believe they are close to agreeing a swap between both proven top race winning drivers, Fangio and Serafini.

Enzo Ferrari wrote: No.
Alfa can have Whitehead.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 24 Apr 2013, 12:33

the Masked Lapwing wrote:
Enzo Ferrari wrote: No.
Alfa can have Whitehead.

Over two years, Fangio will actually have the better record from the two of them if things stay like this. It was a honest deal!

Post by **tommykl** » 25 Apr 2013, 16:26

DanielPT wrote:
the Masked Lapwing wrote:
Enzo Ferrari wrote: No.
Alfa can have Whitehead.

Over two years, Fangio will actually have the better record from the two of them if things stay like this. It was a honest deal!

Actually, performance depends on qualifying pace over the ten previous races, which means over the whole of 1952 for the first race next year. And right now, Serafini would get 23 points to Fangio's 22 (233 to 227). So it will all depend on how the year ends. I'll post a full ranking once the year is over. In the meantime, here's a new thing:

Qualifying is now LIVE!
http://client00.chat.mibbit.com/?server=irc.mibbit.net&channel=%23F1Rejects

Post by **tommykl** » 25 Apr 2013, 18:18

That went a lot faster than I expected. Anyway, here's the chat log for qualifying.

Code: Select all

Dark77   all here for F1WRCR i suppose
18:29   tommykl   I hope so 
18:29   Klon   not sure
18:29   Klon   do I have a driver in this race?
18:29   tommykl   No, you sent all your cars to Australia 
18:29   Klon   perfect
18:30   RealRacingRoots   It looks like everyone has taken the Voecker TMMC car well.  
18:30   tommykl   So, due to how I run the series, qualifying is single-lap, one driver after the other by car number.
18:31   tommykl   The first driver to do a lap will be title contender B. Bira.
18:34   tommykl   And it's not a good lap. A lot of time lost at the Esses and the end of the Straight. It remains to be seen what the other contenders can come up with.
18:35   tommykl   Next is local sportscar driver John Fitch, and he's off to a flyer, taking the first bend flat out!
18:36   tommykl   aaaand, he's missed his chance, losing some time over the next few corners. Inexperience is the cause. He still outpaces his teammate Bira, but only just.
18:37   tommykl   Up comes Louis Chiron in the Commesso. He hasn't finished a race all season, so he needs all the luck he can get.
18:39   tommykl   However, he fails to impress, and ends up far behind the two Talbot-Lagos.
18:39   tommykl   The Ferraris are up next, with Toulo de Graffenried doing the honours.
18:41   tommykl   The Italian Grand Prix winner also seems to be having trouble with the airfield track, having a pretty scruffy lap, but still pretty comfortably outpacing the Talbots to take provisional pole.
18:42   tommykl   Dorino Serafini now, and a pretty steady lap sees him take an easy provisional pole from his teammate.
18:43   tommykl   Reg Parnell is the one who needs a good performance, as the unlikely candidate for the World Championship.
18:43   tommykl   Sadly, the Briton disappoints and ends up just ahead of Fitch, in third place so far.
18:44   tommykl   Next comes Robert Manzon in the Gordini.
18:45   tommykl   However, he also fails to meet expectations, just beating Parnell. The title challengers aren't having a very good day so far.
18:45   tommykl   Consalvo Sanesi is next, the unluckiest man of the year so far.
18:46   tommykl   He easily outpaces his teammate to take a provisional second place behind Dorino Serafini.
18:47   tommykl   Next is the revigorated Claes Racing Developments, frehs from Johnny's fifth place finish at Monza. Macklin is up first.
18:50   tommykl   And what a lap by Lance Macklin! He catches all the big boys unawares by doing his damned best to be inch-perfect all over the track (or at least as best he could accounting for his own talent and machinery), and actually manages to beat Serafini to provisional pole!
18:51   tommykl   Meanwhile, Johnny did his owned damned best to be incredibly slow, ending up last by a sizeable margin, becoming an easy target even for the Bentleys.
18:53   tommykl   The local boys are next, with Group Ultimate now on the circuit. Harry Schell is up first.
18:54   tommykl   And it appears that the bumpy surface is becoming a challenge for every driver, as Schell also struggles for speed, ending up provisionally third-last, ahead of Chiron and Claes.
18:55   tommykl   Troy Ruttman will have to do better to make up for it.
18:57   tommykl   However, he only manages to do slightly better, which isn't good enough. He'll definitely start just behind John Fitch, having ended up as close to his countryman as humanly possible.
18:57   tommykl   JAMR follows, with Gonzalez up first.
18:58   tommykl   Like the rest, he fails to impress, and ends up mired in the lower midfield as a result.
19:00   tommykl   Taruffi does much better, barely outqualifying de Graffenried to take a provisional fourth place out of 14.
19:01   tommykl   Edgar Barth is next. Surprisingly, his presence in the United States has not caused much of a stir in the political world, which is a good sign for the future. Now though, he has to focus on his lap time.
19:02   tommykl   Does it need to be said? Barth also fails to show any sort of speed, falling just short of Gonzalez, at the bottom of the pack.
19:03   tommykl   Next is the factory Maserati, driven by F1's resident guest driver Maurice Trintignant.
19:05   tommykl   And if there is one thing Maurice is good at, it's making the most of opportunities. He does the best he could with the factory Maserati (outpaced by customer machinery), and slips in between Taruffi and de Graffenried, well inside the top ten.
19:06   tommykl   ENB's local Belgian is next, with Charles van Acker taking part in his final European-style race.
19:07   tommykl   It could be argued though that Charles wasn't really the man for the job, and the choice of a Kurtis-Kraft-Offenhauser wasn't really the best the team could make. Worse still, van Acker looked completely demotivated. Result: provisional last place, and by far.
19:08   tommykl   Next comes the always surprising yet always inconsistent Nello Pagani in his Redman Maserati.
19:09   tommykl   This time, he was simply average, but with the frontrunners self-destructing so far, Nello takes his Maserati to a provisional seventh place out of 18.
19:10   tommykl   The Ambrosianas are next, with more points an objective for them.
19:12   tommykl   And suddenly, out of nowhere, Giovanni Bracco records a stunning lap to take provisional pole away from Lance Macklin! With only the Alfas remaining as serious contenders, we might actually see an Ambrosiana on pole!
19:13   tommykl   Rubirosa's lap looked tame by comparison, but is still nothing to be sniffed at, ending up just short of Toulo de Graffenried's time.
19:13   tommykl   Before the serious contenders comes the weekend's novelty attraction: Maria Teresa de Filippis.
19:16   tommykl   And unlike her supposedly quicker male counterparts, Maria kept her head out of her own arse and drove a decent lap to 11th from 21.
19:16   tommykl   But now, it's serious. Giuseppe Farina needs a decent lap to increase his chances of keeping his title.
19:18   tommykl   And while the defending double champion does indeed manage to beat his challengers, he only manages fourth place, behind the likes of Bracco, Macklin and Serafini.
19:19   tommykl   ...and Fangio, who just manages to outqualify his teammate, with whom relations have been getting pretty strained lately, leading to Fangio's announced departure from Alfa Romeo.
19:20   tommykl   Only Moss remained, although he ought never to have bothered, really, as he didn't even manage to clear Edgar Barth, ending up far, far away from the font of the grid.
19:20   tommykl   Alberto Ascari is next in the plucky Phoenix.
19:22      *** pi3141 quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
19:23   tommykl   And he also drives a bloody quick lap, falling just short of Bracco for pole position! A Bracco-Ascari front row is now almost a certainty!
19:24   tommykl   The Bentleys are up next, with the certainty of making the grid after a stroke of genius from the team management, who entered all three cars in the hope that the 30-car limit would not be reached.
19:26   tommykl   Under no pressure, the three Britons could take it easy. Hawthorn definitely did so, yet still comfortably outpaced the hopeless van Acker.
19:27   tommykl   Richardson took it even easier, yet failed to do so, ending up almost definitely last on the grid.
19:28   tommykl   Salvadori took the hint, and gave a bit more input, outpacing Richardson and van Acker.
19:28   tommykl   After this backmarker interlude, we return to the front of the grid, with the final frontrunner and final driver of the session: Tony Bettenhausen.
19:30   tommykl   And all chances he had of pole pretty much vanished when he ran wide at the first corner. Then the second. Then the third. He ended up a long, long way back, beating only the Bentleys and the Belgians.

Performance

Bracco - 85
Macklin - 86
Trintignant - 92
Fitch - 94
Rubirosa - 94
Ascari - 94
de Filippis - 95
Taruffi - 100
Pagani - 100
Fangio - 100
Serafini - 101
Sanesi - 101
Chiron - 102
Barth - 102
Salvadori - 102
Farina - 103
Van Acker - 104
Gonzalez - 105
Hawthorn - 105
de Graffenried - 107
Manzon - 108
Richardson - 108
Ruttman - 109
Bira - 111
Parnell - 111
Moss - 112
Schell - 113
Claes - 119
Bettenhausen - 119
220.2
Standings
1. Giovanni Bracco (Ambrosiana-Maserati) - 3:40.2
2. Alberto Ascari (Phoenix-Ferrari) - 3:40.4
3. Lance Macklin (Maserati) - 3:41.3
4. Dorino Serafini (Ferrari) - 3:41.4
5. Juan Manuel Fangio (Alfa Romeo) - 3:41.5
6. Giuseppe Farina (Alfa Romeo) - 3:41.7
7. Consalvo Sanesi (Gordini) - 3:42.2
8. Piero Taruffi (Aston Martin-Jaguar) - 3:42.3
9. Maurice Trintignant (Maserati) - 3:42.4
10. Toulo de Graffenried (Ferrari) - 3:42.5
11. Porfirio Rubirosa (Ambrosiana-Maserati) - 3:42.6
12. Nello Pagani (Maserati) - 3:43.1
13. Robert Manzon (Gordini) - 3:43.3
14. Maria Teresa de Filippis (Alfa Romeo) - 3:43.4
15. Reg Parnell (Ferrari) - 3:43.5
16. John Fitch (Talbot-Lago-Talbot) - 3:43.7
17. Troy Ruttman (Ferrari) - 3:43.8
18. B. Bira (Talbot-Lago-Talbot) - 3:43.9
19. José Froilan Gonzalez (Aston Martin-Jaguar) - 3:44.6
20. Edgar Barth (Ultimate-BMW) - 3:44.7
21. Stirling Moss (Alfa Romeo) - 3:44.8
22. Harry Schell (Ferrari) - 3:45.0
23. Louis Chiron (Maserati-Ferrari) - 3:45.1
24. Tony Bettenhausen (Aston Martin-Jaguar) - 3:46.8
25. Johnny Claes (Maserati) - 3:47.7
26. Mike Hawthorn (Bentley) - 3:47.9
27. Roy Salvadori (Bentley) - 3:48.1
28. Charles Van Acker (Kurtis Kraft-Offenhausen) - 3:48.8
29. Geoff Richardson (Bentley) - 3:49.0

Bleu · Post by **Bleu** » 27 Apr 2013, 08:07

Pretty happy with Fitch's performance, but disappointed with Bira's one.

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 27 Apr 2013, 08:11

Now that's a pretty messed-up grid if you ask me. Looks like we'll be in for an entertaining race :mrgreen:

Post by **tommykl** » 27 Apr 2013, 12:01

Race performance:

Richardson -62
Bettenhausen -31
Chiron -27
Salvadori -23
Schell -21
Serafini -15
Gonzalez -13
Claes -11
Farina -10
Ruttman -8
Sanesi -5
de Filippis -5
Trintignant -2
Bira -2
Parnell 1
Van Acker 3
Bracco 9
de Graffenried 10
Fitch 10
Moss 12
Taruffi 13
Manzon 15
Hawthorn 17
Macklin 19
Pagani 22
Barth 37
Rubirosa 38
Fangio 46
Ascari 49

Also, with 16 finishers, this will be very entertaining indeed.

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 27 Apr 2013, 12:11

tommykl wrote:Race performance:

Richardson -62
Bettenhausen -31
...

Dear lord, if he wasn't in that crapbox Bentley, it'd be one of the most dominant wins in F1R history :shock:

pi314159 · Post by **pi314159** » 27 Apr 2013, 12:13

If she finishes, this could be a good result for de Filippis.

pasta_maldonado · Post by **pasta_maldonado** » 27 Apr 2013, 12:35

Wizzie wrote:
tommykl wrote:Race performance:

Richardson -62
Bettenhausen -31
...

Dear lord, if he wasn't in that crapbox Bentley, it'd be one of the most dominant wins in F1R history

Dear lord, if he finishes we can get points!!

Post by **tommykl** » 03 May 2013, 15:49

October 5th 1952, United States Grand Prix

Bracco was slow off the grid and lost the lead to Ascari, with Macklin fending off Serafini and Fangio. Farina's start was also sluggish, and he was passed by Sanesi and Trintignant. Bracco was still there though, and he slipstreamed past Ascari to take the lead once more on lap 2. Macklin couldn't keep the pace, however, and he dropped behind Serafini.

Ascari and Bracco's duel was slowing them down, though, and Serafini was right behind them at the start of lap 5. At the end of said lap, Ascari was in the lead ahead of Serafini and Bracco. Then came Macklin, Taruffi, de Graffenried, Sanesi, Farina, Manzon and Trintignant. Fangio was the first retirement when his engine failed on lap four.

Ascari was building up his lead, while Bracco and Serafini were unable to keep up and were joined by de Graffenried, Taruffi, Sanesi and Macklin, then Manzon. This is all approximate, of course, as positions were changing all the time. Serafini, however, was breaking away and gaining ground on Ascari, followed by de Graffenried and Taruffi, who was busy setting insanely quick laps (although Manzon held the fastest lap).

After a quarter of the race (12 laps), Ascari still led from Taruffi, Serafini, de Graffenried and Macklin. Then came Sanesi, Bracco, Manzon, Schell (alerady?), Farina (tenth), Parnell, de Filippis, Pagani, Bira, Trintignant, Fitch, Bettenhausen, Rubirosa, Ruttman, Moss (20th), Gonzalez, Chiron, Claes, Barth, Salvadori, Van Acker, Hawthorn and Richardson, who had had a horrendous start to the race.

Ascari's lead was still uncertain, and Taruffi and Serafini were both quickly catching up. The battle for fifth was also getting more intense, with Bracco, Sanesi, Macklin and Schell all within three seconds of each other. Then, Bracco broke away, while Farina and Manzon joined the fight, while Sanesi fell back. Further back, Richardson was being very impressive after his initial setback, having already passed Hawthorn, Barth, Van Acker and Salvadori.

The second retirement of the race came on lap 18, where Troy Ruttman span off at the Esses while fighting for fourteenth with Parnell, Fitch, Bettenhausen and de Filippis. On the next lap, Ascari finally lost his lead to Dorino Serafini, while Robert Manzon set what would remain the race's fastest lap. Reg Parnell also joined the hardly bounded battle for fifth place.

Taruffi was losing ground and getting caught by Giovanni Bracco and Robert Manzon. De Graffenried also passed Ascari for second place, making it a Ferrari 1-2. Taruffi was then passed by Bracco, who also caught Ascari. Manzon was also catching Taruffi, while Farina was also gaining ground on all of them.

At the halfway mark of the race, Serafini led from de Graffenried, Ascari, Bracco, Manzon (fifth), Taruffi, Farina, Parnell, Schell, Macklin (tenth), Bettenhausen, Sanesi, Fitch, Bira, de Filippis, Trintignant, Pagani, Chiron, Moss, Rubirosa (20th), Claes, Richardson, Salvadori, Barth, Van Acker and Hawthorn. Gonzalez' race was also over, having crashed out on lap 23. He put a wheel on the grass at the first corner, lost control and was sent into the wall. He was in 21st position.

Gonzalez was followed by Nello Pagani, whose Maserati gearbox failde him on the next lap, out of seventeenth place, leaving 25 cars still in the race. Then, while Serafini was making sure he won the race, the race behind him changed massively from lap 30 onwards, with less than twenty lap remaining. On lap 31, de Filippis' Alfa Romeo broke down, leaving oil on the track. Alberto Ascari was following, and he skidded on the oil slick, sliding into the straw bales at high speed, the car digging into the grass and doing a barrell-roll in the air and landing on its wheels. Alberto was thrown out of the car, but walked back to the pits uninjured. Maria was 18th, Alberto fifth.

On the following lap, Bracco's Ambrosiana suffered a suspension failure, throwing him out of the race as well, out of second position, no less! In the next two laps, Sanesi and Macklin both retired as well from mechanical failures, out of third and sixth respectively. This changed the whole order at the very front, and after Salvadori's retirement from 17th position, the minor points were much changed by lap 36 (three-quarters of the race).

Serafini's lead was now nigh on unassailable, but the fight for second was unbelievably tight, with Parnell (how?), Bettenhausen (HOW?), Farina, de Graffenried and Manzon all within ten seconds of each other! A bit further behind, Bira and Schell (how on Earth...?) were fighting over seventh place, with Trintignant and Chiron (I'm lost) doing the same over ninth. Then came Taruffi, Moss, Claes, Richardson (IMPOSSIBRU!), Rubirosa, Fitch, Barth, Van Acker and Hawthorn.

Two laps later, Mike Hawthorn span out. The Bentley hit a straw bale awkwardly, and Mike tried to block it with his hand. It worked, but he got out of the car in visible pain and clutching at his wrist.

At the almost very front, Farina was making a mockery out of the battle for second, setting quick lap after quick lap to easily put de Graffenried et al a fair way behind him. On lap 41, Johnny Claes retired from 13th position, having just been passed by the staggering Geoff Richardson.

In the end, while Serafini and Farina easily finished 1-2, de Graffenried eased home to take third place, while Parnell and Schell had to be separated by a photo-finish for fourth place. Bira and Manzon are the big losers of the race, finishing only seventh and eighth, leaving Bira as the only mathematical contender to Farina. Maurice Trintignant delights Maserati by taking a commendable ninth place, the team's first top ten finish under its new identity, while Geoff Richardson somehow manages to drag his Bentley kicking and screaming to eleventh place, the team's first finish, and ahead of five different cars, believe it or not! Tony Bettenhausen was contending for points when he retired with two laps remaining, and he was eventually classified in twelfth position.

1. Dorino Serafini (Ferrari) 3:04:09.6
2. Giuseppe Farina (Alfa Romeo) +1:39.4
3. Toulo de Graffenried (Ferrari) +1 lap
4. Reg Parnell (Ferrari) +1 lap
5. Harry Schell (Ferrari) +1 lap
6. Piero Taruffi (Aston Martin-Jaguar) +2 laps
7. B. Bira (Talbot-Lago-Talbot) +2 laps
8. Robert Manzon (Gordini) +2 laps
9. Maurice Trintignant (Maserati) +2 laps
10. Louis Chiron (Maserati-Ferrari) +2 laps
11. Geoff Richardson (Bentley) +2 laps
12. Tony Bettenhausen (Aston Martin-Jaguar) +3 laps/Overheating
13. Stirling Moss (Alfa Romeo) +3 laps
14. John Fitch (Talbot-Lago-Talbot) +3 laps
15. Porfirio Rubirosa (Ambrosiana-Maserati) +3 laps
16. Edgar Barth (Ultimate-BMW) +4 laps
17. Charles Van Acker (Kurtis Kraft-Offenhauser) +5 laps
Ret. Johnny Claes (Maserati) +8 laps/Transmission
Ret. Mike Hawthorn (Bentley) +10 laps/Span out
Ret. Roy Salvadori (Bentley) +13 laps/Engine
Ret. Lance Macklin (Maserati) +15 laps/Gearbox
Ret. Consalvo Sanesi (Gordini) +16 laps/Gearbox
Ret. Giovanni Bracco (Ambrosiana-Maserati) +17 laps/Suspension
Ret. Alberto Ascari (Phoenix-Ferrari) +18 laps/Accident
Ret. Maria Teresa de Filippis (Alfa Romeo) +19 laps/Oil leak
Ret. Nello Pagani (Maserati) +24 laps/Transmission
Ret. José Froilan Gonzalez (Aston Martin-Jaguar) +25 laps/Accident
Ret. Troy Ruttman (Ferrari) +31 laps/Span out
Ret. Juan Manuel Fangio (Alfa Romeo) +45 laps/Engine

Fastest lap: Robert Manzon (Gordini) - 3:41.3

Championship standings
Drivers
1. Giuseppe Farina - 28.5
2. B. Bira - 21
3. Robert Manzon - 18.5
4. Reg Parnell - 18
5. Dorino Serafini - 17
6. Alberto Ascari - 14
7. Toulo de Graffenried - 13 (1 win)
8. Juan Manuel Fangio - 13 (1 2nd)
9. André Simon - 12
10. Consalvo Sanesi - 11
11. Tony Bettenhausen - 10
12. Troy Ruttman - 9
13. Piero Taruffi - 8
14. Harry Schell - 7
15. Giovanni Bracco - 6
16. Eric Brandon - 4
17. Peter Whitehead - 2 (1 5th, 2 6ths)
18. Johnny Claes - 2 (1 5th, 1 6th)
19. Nello Pagani - 2 (1 5th, 1 9th)

Constructors
1. Ferrari - 43
2. Alfa Romeo - 35.5
3. Talbot-Lago-Talbot - 32
4. Gordini - 22.5
5. Aston Martin-Jaguar - 14 (1 2nd, 3 3rds)
6. Phoenix-Ferrari - 14 (1 2nd, 2 3rds)
7. Ambrosiana-Maserati - 6
8. Ferrari-Jaguar - 4 (1 3rd)
9. Maserati - 4 (2 5ths)

Entrants
1. Scuderia Ferrari - 36
2. Alfa Romeo SpA - 35.5
3. Motorsport Bleu - 32
4. Alexander Racing Team - 22.5
5. Jaguar - Aston Martin Racing - 14 (1 2nd, 3 3rds)
6. Phoenix Racing Organisation - 14 (1 2nd, 2 3rds)
7. Group Ultimate - 9
8. Scuderia Ambrosiana - 6
9. Scuderia Maremmana - 4
10. Claes Racing Developments - 2 (1 5th, 1 6th)
11. Redman Racing Team - 2 (1 5th, 1 9th)

Ferraris dominate the race, with a 1-3-4-5, while Farina nearly seals his third straight championship. In other news, Louis Chiron finally finishes a race this season.

Also, it is with great sadness that we announce the passing of William Schindler. The American had previsouly competed at Indianapolis in 1951, finishing 19th, and in 1952, finishing 14th. On September 20th, Schindler suffered a violent accident in a sprint car race at Allentown, and succumbed from his injuries at the age of 43.

Injury report up soon.

Post by **tommykl** » 03 May 2013, 16:44

Hawthorn injured in accident

23-year-old Mike Hawthorn suffered a fractured wrist in last Sunday's United States Grand Prix at Sebring Raceway. The young Briton span into the straw bales, and while protecting his head from the bales, one of them struck his hand, bending it back too far, fracturing Hawthorn's wrist.

His recovery is expected to take five weeks, and Hawthorn will therefore miss the Australian Grand Prix held in Leyburn.

Post by **tommykl** » 03 May 2013, 16:44

tommykl wrote:
Hawthorn injured in accident

23-year-old Mike Hawthorn suffered a fractured wrist in last Sunday's United States Grand Prix at Sebring Raceway. The young Briton span into the straw bales, and while protecting his head from the bales, one of them struck his hand, bending it back too far, fracturing Hawthorn's wrist.

His recovery is expected to take five weeks, and Hawthorn will therefore miss the Australian Grand Prix held in Leyburn.

In other words, pasta, you need another driver. If I may make a small suggestion, I believe Geoff Richardson would be a good pick.

pasta_maldonado · Post by **pasta_maldonado** » 03 May 2013, 16:50

tommykl wrote:
tommykl wrote:
Hawthorn injured in accident

23-year-old Mike Hawthorn suffered a fractured wrist in last Sunday's United States Grand Prix at Sebring Raceway. The young Briton span into the straw bales, and while protecting his head from the bales, one of them struck his hand, bending it back too far, fracturing Hawthorn's wrist.

His recovery is expected to take five weeks, and Hawthorn will therefore miss the Australian Grand Prix held in Leyburn.

In other words, pasta, you need another driver. If I may make a small suggestion, I believe Geoff Richardson would be a good pick.

Yep, Richardson is in for Oz and has earned himself a full time drive for next year!

FantometteBR · Post by **FantometteBR** » 03 May 2013, 17:01

Is there a way for us to have Trintignant in 1953?

Post by **tommykl** » 03 May 2013, 17:23

FantometteBR wrote:Is there a way for us to have Trintignant in 1953?

You'll need to negociate with This for that

pasta_maldonado wrote:
tommykl wrote:
Hawthorn injured in accident

23-year-old Mike Hawthorn suffered a fractured wrist in last Sunday's United States Grand Prix at Sebring Raceway. The young Briton span into the straw bales, and while protecting his head from the bales, one of them struck his hand, bending it back too far, fracturing Hawthorn's wrist.

His recovery is expected to take five weeks, and Hawthorn will therefore miss the Australian Grand Prix held in Leyburn.

In other words, pasta, you need another driver. If I may make a small suggestion, I believe Geoff Richardson would be a good pick.

Yep, Richardson is in for Oz and has earned himself a full time drive for next year!

Expected as much

And I can pretty safely say that if Geoff does a half-decent performance in Leyburn, he just might make the grid

Nessafox · Post by **Nessafox** » 03 May 2013, 20:38

tommykl wrote:
FantometteBR wrote:Is there a way for us to have Trintignant in 1953?

You'll need to negociate with This for that

He will choose between Maserati and Jaguar/Aston Martin, as he will also drive for JAMR in Australia. Whichever of both teams can provide him the best result will be his first choice. So if JAMR messes up, he's yours

Post by **tommykl** » 04 May 2013, 05:28

Okay, so the calendar is nearly completely confirmed. Monza, Monaco, Spa, Silverstone, Nürburgring, Reims, Zandvoort and Sebring are all on the calendar.

Two more circuits are in the gray area. I'll host a secondary vote. The first ten votes will be counted, and you can give both tracks either -1, 0 or +1. If the circuit ends up with a positive score, it will be on the calendar.

Rouen-les-Essarts -1
Bremgarten +1

pi314159 · Post by **pi314159** » 04 May 2013, 06:20

Rouen les Essarts : +1
Bremgarten : +1

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 04 May 2013, 06:21

pi314159 wrote:Rouen les Essarts : +1
Bremgarten : +1

+1 as well. The more races, the merrier in my opinion :mrgreen:

Post by **Nuppiz** » 04 May 2013, 17:24

Birmingham Motorsports gives Bremgarten +1, but remains neutral (0) with Rouen-Les-Essarts.

FantometteBR · Post by **FantometteBR** » 04 May 2013, 17:58

Rouen-les-Essarts -1
Bremgarten - +1

Aerospeed · Post by **Aerospeed** » 04 May 2013, 21:22

Both tracks get a -1 in my views

Klon · Post by **Klon** » 04 May 2013, 22:12

JeremyMcClean wrote:Both tracks get a -1 in my views

I will agree.