The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

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The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by jackanderton »

Image

What a guy.

I thought I'd make this thread for my other obsession in the midfield of Formula 1. After a shocking start to the year, Kobayashi scored a point in Turkey. From there, he smashed his car into the wall of champions in Canada, and racked up 4 seperate points finishes. The guy continues delivering in terms of entertainment value, and the knowledge that while he's on the grid, anything can happen at any point, that has really livened up a lot of races this year.

And the midfield has been really exciting this year now that points are on offer for the top ten. With rookies like Petrov/Hulkenburg/Kobayashi/Alguersuari duking it out for points with the likes of Michael Schumacher, there's been so much action, especially towards the end of races, and Kobayashi delivers his fair share.

A month or so ago Murray Walker claimed Kobayashi will become Japan's most successful F1 driver, and he isn't the only person who is quite taken with him. I actually thought his race at Spa was quite underwhelming, but he drove the right race for the right conditions- he avoided trouble and didn't panic about being overtaken. He reaped the rewards at the end for a 'where did that come from?' 8th place, while his supposedly calmer experienced teammate squandered a similarly promising position.

Where does he go from here? I want your predictions on his F1 future, for the rest of the season and beyond.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by ADx_Wales »

One sixth place finish away from not being a certified reject....

...do we want that to happen?
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by eytl »

Thinks to self: "Thank goodness Captain Hammer doesn't have moderator or admin powers ..."

But seriously, assuming that this is still Kamui's first season, the problem with Japanese drivers has always been the follow-up album. Satoru Nakajima in 1988 was rubbish after a decent 1987. Aguri Suzuki in 1991 was rubbish after a very good 1990 including that memorable Suzuka podium. Ukyo Katayama was rubbish in 1995 after his brilliant 1994 when I reckon he could have scored around 25 points (on the old top-six only points system). Takuma Sato was Reject of the Year in 2005 after that tremendous 2004. Yuji Ide was rubbish after ... actually, screw that, he was just rubbish full stop.

I await Kamui's activity in 2011 (a nod to the Germgarian podcast if you haven't listened to it ... shame on you!) with baited breath.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by CarlosFerreira »

Well, him and Sutil really are the most lovable drivers out there in the midfield...

A couple of interesting thing about Kobayashi: first, he seems better prepared than many of his countrymen. Fluent in English, good PR, technically close to the team. Second, and as a follow-up from that, I think he is the first Japanese driver to find himself in F1 without any support from Japanese manufacturers or large/relevant Japanese sponsors. That is seriously impressive, and a good indication that he might be the genuine article: he's there on merit. And he's holding on nicely.

Much as Sutil needed to improve his capacity to stay out of trouble, Kamui needs to work on his qualifying performances. Here's a man who is a brilliant racer, but hardly a decent qualifier. We always expect Liuzzi to be the drop-out man in Q1, but Kobayashi has screwed up just as often (if not more often) than Tonio.

And still... race after race, he's come back from the dead on sheer ability. He's proved to have racecraft to show half the paddock how it's done, both on pounding round and saving tyres, and on pouncing and passing. The best showing of any driver all year has been Kobayashi's in Valencia, if you ask me.

I certainly expect more to come from him. He's got a steep road ahead - but maybe, in 4 or 5 year's time, we'll be watching him launch a WDC campaign. Hey, with a title like this thread's, I'm not mincing my words. :D
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by fjackdaw »

ADx_Wales wrote:One sixth place finish away from not being a certified reject....

...do we want that to happen?


Yes. F1 is already pretty well stocked with Japanese rejects - KK is the real deal.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by Phoenix »

I see it. Kobayashi stays with Sauber for 2011 after unrejectifying himself this year, Sauber produces a competent car, he scores some podiums and regularly scores, finishing 6th or 7th in the championship, after which Ferrari dumps Massa for underperforming badly on purpose as a revenge for the shameful treatment the team had dispensed him during the year and signs our man. Kobayashi then proceeds to thrash Alonso, Hamilton, Vettel and Button to take the crown in 2012. He'll say with Ferrari until 2016, winning 2 more titles, then he'll move to the Geely team after being offered a pay rise there, winning 2 more titles, equalling Fangio's tally of 5 WDCs, and then he'll retire and proceed to nuke the opposition in Indy Cars.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by Ferrim »

eytl wrote:Thinks to self: "Thank goodness Captain Hammer doesn't have moderator or admin powers ..."

But seriously, assuming that this is still Kamui's first season, the problem with Japanese drivers has always been the follow-up album. Satoru Nakajima in 1988 was rubbish after a decent 1987. Aguri Suzuki in 1991 was rubbish after a very good 1990 including that memorable Suzuka podium. Ukyo Katayama was rubbish in 1995 after his brilliant 1994 when I reckon he could have scored around 25 points (on the old top-six only points system). Takuma Sato was Reject of the Year in 2005 after that tremendous 2004. Yuji Ide was rubbish after ... actually, screw that, he was just rubbish full stop.

I await Kamui's activity in 2011 (a nod to the Germgarian podcast if you haven't listened to it ... shame on you!) with baited breath.


Well, don't allow memory to distort facts. Nakajima in 1987 and Sato in 2004 were utterly destroyed by their teammates, so I don't think that's comparable with Kobayashi's 2009-10. Suzuki in 1991 and Katayama in 1994 do make for comparison, though.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by Klon »

Ferrim wrote:Well, don't allow memory to distort facts. Nakajima in 1987 and Sato in 2004 were utterly destroyed by their teammates, so I don't think that's comparable with Kobayashi's 2009-10. Suzuki in 1991 and Katayama in 1994 do make for comparison, though.


Yes, because Pedro De La Rosa sure is a good comparison with Aryton Senna and the whole of BAR. :lol:
Kobayashi sure has potential, but until he becomes the best Japanese driver in F1 history, there is still a looooooooong way to go. We can begin to talk about that in 2015. ;)
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by DonTirri »

Klon wrote:
Ferrim wrote:Well, don't allow memory to distort facts. Nakajima in 1987 and Sato in 2004 were utterly destroyed by their teammates, so I don't think that's comparable with Kobayashi's 2009-10. Suzuki in 1991 and Katayama in 1994 do make for comparison, though.


Yes, because Pedro De La Rosa sure is a good comparison with Aryton Senna and the whole of BAR. :lol:
Kobayashi sure has potential, but until he becomes the best Japanese driver in F1 history, there is still a looooooooong way to go. We can begin to talk about that in 2015. ;)


Actually, all he needs is two podiums and he'll be the best ever Japanese driver in F1 history! And Quite frankly, if he can get even a semi-decent car for next year, I think he can pull it off. 2012 the latest i'd say.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by Waris »

Ferrim wrote:
eytl wrote:Thinks to self: "Thank goodness Captain Hammer doesn't have moderator or admin powers ..."

But seriously, assuming that this is still Kamui's first season, the problem with Japanese drivers has always been the follow-up album. Satoru Nakajima in 1988 was rubbish after a decent 1987. Aguri Suzuki in 1991 was rubbish after a very good 1990 including that memorable Suzuka podium. Ukyo Katayama was rubbish in 1995 after his brilliant 1994 when I reckon he could have scored around 25 points (on the old top-six only points system). Takuma Sato was Reject of the Year in 2005 after that tremendous 2004. Yuji Ide was rubbish after ... actually, screw that, he was just rubbish full stop.

I await Kamui's activity in 2011 (a nod to the Germgarian podcast if you haven't listened to it ... shame on you!) with baited breath.


Well, don't allow memory to distort facts. Nakajima in 1987 and Sato in 2004 were utterly destroyed by their teammates, so I don't think that's comparable with Kobayashi's 2009-10. Suzuki in 1991 and Katayama in 1994 do make for comparison, though.


To be fair, those weren't their second seasons. If you look at the actual SECOND seasons (1990 and 1993, respectively), they were actually much better than their first seasons.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by F1000X »

Phoenix wrote:I see it. Kobayashi stays with Sauber for 2011 after unrejectifying himself this year, Sauber produces a competent car, he scores some podiums and regularly scores, finishing 6th or 7th in the championship, after which Ferrari dumps Massa for underperforming badly on purpose as a revenge for the shameful treatment the team had dispensed him during the year and signs our man. Kobayashi then proceeds to thrash Alonso, Hamilton, Vettel and Button to take the crown in 2012. He'll say with Ferrari until 2016, winning 2 more titles, then he'll move to the Geely team after being offered a pay rise there, winning 2 more titles, equalling Fangio's tally of 5 WDCs, and then he'll retire and proceed to nuke the opposition in Indy Cars.

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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by Klon »

DonTirri wrote:Actually, all he needs is two podiums and he'll be the best ever Japanese driver in F1 history! And Quite frankly, if he can get even a semi-decent car for next year, I think he can pull it off. 2012 the latest i'd say.


From a statistic point of view, to say it like it is. And I doubt it, unless he actually gets a Red Bull, Ferrari or a McLaren, i.e. an absolute top-field car, that he can get two podiums next year. As I was stating before, he's still no Takuma Sato, not at all. ;)
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by LukeB »

Phoenix wrote:I see it. Kobayashi stays with Sauber for 2011 after unrejectifying himself this year, Sauber produces a competent car, he scores some podiums and regularly scores, finishing 6th or 7th in the championship, after which Ferrari dumps Massa for underperforming badly on purpose as a revenge for the shameful treatment the team had dispensed him during the year and signs our man.


The only thing that could cause me to climb off the Kobayashi bandwagon would be if he signed for Ferrari (or to a ever so slightly lesser extent, McLaren). Enough of your hateful lies, it's clear that Kobayashi will be the man that leads Force India to championship glory!
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by ADx_Wales »

Can we please count his first and only races in a Toyota as one whole season, they were worthy of it. He is on the second album , and has been struggling, now he's on the limited edition with remixes version of second album which is worthy of collection.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by mario »

eytl wrote:Thinks to self: "Thank goodness Captain Hammer doesn't have moderator or admin powers ..."

But seriously, assuming that this is still Kamui's first season, the problem with Japanese drivers has always been the follow-up album. Satoru Nakajima in 1988 was rubbish after a decent 1987. Aguri Suzuki in 1991 was rubbish after a very good 1990 including that memorable Suzuka podium. Ukyo Katayama was rubbish in 1995 after his brilliant 1994 when I reckon he could have scored around 25 points (on the old top-six only points system). Takuma Sato was Reject of the Year in 2005 after that tremendous 2004. Yuji Ide was rubbish after ... actually, screw that, he was just rubbish full stop.

I await Kamui's activity in 2011 (a nod to the Germgarian podcast if you haven't listened to it ... shame on you!) with baited breath.

You could also add on Kazuki Nakajima, potentially - he had a 6th place, two 7th's and two 8th's in his first season, which was not too shabby - Rosberg's two podium finishes that year were heavily influenced by good luck (the 3rd place in Australia owed a lot to attrition, and his 2nd place in Singapore was in part due to the safety car rules that year, and the very slow response of the stewards), and the only other points finishes that Rosberg picked up in 2008 were three 8th's. But, by comparison, his 2009 season was a shocker - even with points down to 8th place, he failed to score entirely, and that despite some races with a high attrition rate along the way where he might have picked up points.

I wouldn't say, though, that it is just a Japanese phenomenon - the second season has always been the hardest, in many ways, both for drivers and teams. Generally, the first season is simply about making sure that you get into the next season, often enough, and you can get away with a few poor performances (they can be excused due to inexperience, poor strategy calls or overdriving a car) but it is the second season where you are expected to do the hard work, come to the fore and deliver. For example, Bernie expects that the most vulnerable teams will fold after the year is up (when the full costs and problems of designing a new car kick in after the season is over), and there have been a number of instances where a driver has been given a second chance, only to drive poorly and be replaced the following season.

Can Kazuki stay in the sport? Well, so far, his performance at Sauber has been promising enough, following the difficult patch earlier in the year when the engine spent most of its time smoking like a Frenchman with free Gauloises. However, with most of the top teams probably ruling out any driver changes (only Petrov's seat is potentially up for grabs at Renault, and there are a lot of other drivers fighting for that seat), the best team he could probably go with is Sauber - so, he is probably just going to be battling for the lower end of the points table. It isn't a bad thing - being so competitive, it'll help forge your skills quickly, especially since the fighting is often fiercer in the mid pack then the front (where the drivers are, naturally, more cautious - or at least normally they are - because they have more to loose if something goes wrong).

Now, there is a good chance that Sauber may replace De La Rosa at the end of the season - I can't imagine that the team will be pleased with him throwing away a point at Spa, and he has struggled to match Kobayashi throughout the season during the races. If they do, it is crucial that Kobayashi outscores his rival - but it is also crucial that Kobayashi, should it fall to him, shows that he can lead a team. He also has to improve on his qualifying performances - yes, his starts have been brilliant recently, but he could do so much better if he wasn't so far down the grid in the first place, as all his starts are doing is putting him back roughly where he should have been in qualifying anyway.

Does he have the potential? So far, he has the potential to at least be his country's highest points scorer if he gets a reasonable car. Does he have the consistency and leadership skills? That is harder to tell - hopefully he does, though.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by eytl »

For the avoidance of doubt (now there's some lawyer-speak for you), I was referring not necessarily to actual first and second seasons, but second seasons after a good (or at least commendable) season by a Japanese driver.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by Walsh_e »

Kobayashi is certainly showing great racing speed and race craft, just needs to get his qualifying performances sorted really, another few years at Sauber continuing to perform could see him make the step up, perhaps to Renault, Red Bull (always looking to sell more drinks!) or maybe even Lotus if they can use their money to get near the front.

I'd love to see him and Petrov in a top team, they'd be crap at qualifying but the race would be so entertaining watching them both power through the field!
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by CarlosFerreira »

ADx_Wales wrote:Can we please count his first and only races in a Toyota as one whole season, they were worthy of it. He is on the second album , and has been struggling, now he's on the limited edition with remixes version of second album which is worthy of collection.


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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by jackanderton »

To improve his qualifying performances I reckon Sauber should send him out directly behind Fernando Alonso, whenever he goes out on track.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by Phoenix »

LukeB wrote:
Phoenix wrote:I see it. Kobayashi stays with Sauber for 2011 after unrejectifying himself this year, Sauber produces a competent car, he scores some podiums and regularly scores, finishing 6th or 7th in the championship, after which Ferrari dumps Massa for underperforming badly on purpose as a revenge for the shameful treatment the team had dispensed him during the year and signs our man.


The only thing that could cause me to climb off the Kobayashi bandwagon would be if he signed for Ferrari (or to a ever so slightly lesser extent, McLaren). Enough of your hateful lies, it's clear that Kobayashi will be the man that leads Force India to championship glory!

Lies? HATEFUL? How dare you, sir?!?! :twisted:
jackanderton wrote:To improve his qualifying performances I reckon Sauber should send him out directly behind Sebastian Vettel, whenever he goes out on track.

Fixed.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by Marco »

This was in this weeks Speedweek magazine - the caption says: "Kamui Kobayashis talisman says everything about his driving style."

Now THIS would be a top merchandise item...

Image
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by CarlosFerreira »

Did you see his Suzuka race? Almost as brilliant as Valencia. What an amazing driver he's turning out to be. And let's not forget, shall we, that he's still a rookie!
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by FullMetalJack »

CarlosFerreira wrote:Did you see his Suzuka race? Almost as brilliant as Valencia. What an amazing driver he's turning out to be. And let's not forget, shall we, that he's still a rookie!


If only Hamilton's gearbox problem forced him to retire. If only.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by Phoenix »

CarlosFerreira wrote:Did you see his Suzuka race? Almost as brilliant as Valencia. What an amazing driver he's turning out to be. And let's not forget, shall we, that he's still a rookie!

Yes. Well and truly worth the effort of getting up early that morning.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by CarlosFerreira »

Phoenix wrote:
CarlosFerreira wrote:Did you see his Suzuka race? Almost as brilliant as Valencia. What an amazing driver he's turning out to be. And let's not forget, shall we, that he's still a rookie!

Yes. Well and truly worth the effort of getting up early that morning.


I got that. :oops:
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by Debaser »

Almost as brilliant as Valencia??? I thought his drive yesterday was better than the performance at Valencia, as he overtook more cars in a race than most drivers do in half a season and also invented a new overtaking place. In both races he was superb, but I think Suzuka was better. He really is a cult hero now, no one else comes close for sheer entertainment.
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by AndreaModa »

I'd just like to point out that the overtaking spot at the hairpin has been a favourite of mine on F1C for quite a long while now! :mrgreen:
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by Ferrim »

redbulljack14 wrote:
CarlosFerreira wrote:Did you see his Suzuka race? Almost as brilliant as Valencia. What an amazing driver he's turning out to be. And let's not forget, shall we, that he's still a rookie!


If only Hamilton's gearbox problem forced him to retire. If only.


Don't worry. He will unrejectify himself, sooner rather than later.

Let's enjoy him while he's still a reject. :D
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by DonTirri »

Ferrim wrote:
redbulljack14 wrote:
CarlosFerreira wrote:Did you see his Suzuka race? Almost as brilliant as Valencia. What an amazing driver he's turning out to be. And let's not forget, shall we, that he's still a rookie!


If only Hamilton's gearbox problem forced him to retire. If only.


Don't worry. He will unrejectify himself, sooner rather than later.

Let's enjoy him while he's still a reject. :D


Well i'm going to enjoy him even when he unrejectifies!

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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by captainhappy »

I am really looking forward to seeing Kamui with the #1 on his Team Nintendo/ Mugen Honda/ Bridgestone/ (earth car) entry. What a kick ass drive.


By the way, has Captain Hammer jumped on this bandwagon as yet?
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by madmark1974 »

captainhappy wrote: By the way, has Captain Hammer jumped on this bandwagon as yet?


He tried, but slipped, fell, and got run over by Petrov. :P
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by jackanderton »

He's one of those drivers that doesn't seem content to be hanging around at the back. His lowest recorded placing in a F1 Grand Prix so far is 12th. Pretty good going in a Sauber.

*cough*8 DNFs OH WELL*cough*

My main interest is starting to slide from my longer term F1 love interest Adrian Sutil to the Cowboy.

I hope both Koba and Sutil can finish the rest of the races both in the points. (This will probably require more mess-ups from Hulkenberg and Petrov...and probably Massa too)
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by captainhappy »

madmark1974 wrote:
captainhappy wrote: By the way, has Captain Hammer jumped on this bandwagon as yet?


He tried, but slipped, fell, and got run over by Petrov. :P


HA!
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by FullMetalJack »

DonTirri wrote:Kobayashi Kamui WDC 2011. You heard it here first.


Fixed
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by mario »

jackanderton wrote:He's one of those drivers that doesn't seem content to be hanging around at the back. His lowest recorded placing in a F1 Grand Prix so far is 12th. Pretty good going in a Sauber.

*cough*8 DNFs OH WELL*cough*

My main interest is starting to slide from my longer term F1 love interest Adrian Sutil to the Cowboy.

I hope both Koba and Sutil can finish the rest of the races both in the points. (This will probably require more mess-ups from Hulkenberg and Petrov...and probably Massa too)

To be fair to him, though, the majority of those DNF's were because of reliability problems. His retirements are listed as follows:
Bahrain - Hydraulics failure (Lap 11)
Australia - Collision (Opening lap), due to front wing collapsing and getting stuck under front wheels (which also took out Hulkenberg and Buemi)
Malaysia - Engine failue (Lap 8)
China - Collision (Opening lap), where Liuzzi spun under braking and crashed into Kobayashi.
Monaco - Gearbox failure (Lap 26)
Canada - Accident (Opening lap), where he went over the kerbs in the last chicane and ended up in "The Wall of Champions".
Monza - Gearbox failure (Opening lap), where he tried to start from the pitlane, but retired almost immediately with a gearbox problem.
Singapore - Accident (Lap 30), when he misjudged his entry speed to Turn 18 and ended up in a barrier.

So, out of those DNF's, only two of those were really his fault (Canada and Singapore), since the majority of his problems have been linked to either the transmission system or the engine.
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"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
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captainhappy
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by captainhappy »

captainhappy wrote:
madmark1974 wrote:
captainhappy wrote: By the way, has Captain Hammer jumped on this bandwagon as yet?


He tried, but slipped, fell, and got run over by Petrov. :P


HA!


fixed

Team Nintendo/PANASONIC/ Mugen Honda/ Bridgestone/ (earth car) entry.

Wow, Sauber will be flush with money all of the sudden, with TELMEX on one car and PANASONIC now in talks to sponsor a real Grand Prix team.

And I quote:

Renault's Robert Kubica retired from the race after five minutes with a missing wheel.

Said the Pole: "What Kamui did with his car was super. Because I had to watch on television, he saved my day."
I wake up in the morning and piss excellence
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tkcom
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

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Ferrim
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by Ferrim »

mario wrote:To be fair to him, though, the majority of those DNF's were because of reliability problems.


That is actually saving his season. He's just suffered an engine failure, and had three accidents in the early laps when the Sauber was very unreliable. That has saved him a lot of engine mileage and more than possible engine blow-ups that would make his current engine situation dire, to say the least. De la Rosa was being hampered during his final races because he lasted longer in the early races, and now Heidfeld is suffering too.
Go home, Bernie Ecclestone!

"There will be no other victory this year, I can tell you, more welcomed than this one" Bob Varsha, 1995 Canadian GP

F1 Rejects Forums – going off-topic since 2009!
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watka
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

Post by watka »

tkcom wrote:How can we have the Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread without these?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F69gMeGTvi4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AB1TMy7RIE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JR7MdsEY5jo


Aguri Suzuki met a young Kamui Kobayashi!!! I'm surprised the world didn't explode.
Watka - you know, the swimming horses guy
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Henrique
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Re: The Utterly Smashing Kamui Kobayashi Love Thread

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