Your Reject of the Race - Turkey

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 06 Jun 2009, 11:29

Ready, go!

Lewis Hamilton - two races, two Q1 exits.
Fernando Alonso - a second slower than Piquet in third practice.
FIA-FOTA - both sides equally guilty of playing chicken wih thefuture of Formula One.

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 06 Jun 2009, 11:47

Scuderia Toro Rosso: Slower than both Force Indias... oh dear.
McLaren Mercedes: 2 races. 2 promising Fridays. 2 horror qualifying performances.
Timo Glock: Being generally outshone by Trulli almost all weekend. Out in Q2 while Trulli set the 2nd fastest time all weekend.

Pedro_Diniz · Post by **Pedro_Diniz** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:08

Turn 8

shinji · Post by **shinji** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:31

Lewis Hamilton; Kovaleinen was faster, and he was beaten to Q2 by Sutil. Abysmal.

And that's the way I like it.

Nin13 · Post by **Nin13** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:33

Its too early to say. But but after qualifying it looks like Mclaren are really wanting this award.
Hamilton could not make part Q1 and Mclaren seem to be slower than even Force India. They will have to something spectacular to not get the award.

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:36

Pedro_Diniz wrote:Turn 8

What? Why?

tc3j3r · Post by **tc3j3r** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:41

McLaren look like favourites to me at this stage but we'll all be watching to see what Fisichella does into turn 1 at the start...

Pedro_Diniz · Post by **Pedro_Diniz** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:42

CarlosFerreira wrote:
Pedro_Diniz wrote:Turn 8

What? Why?

For giving us Piquet's double-whammy of reject offings in qualifying! I think it's an ironic reject award, actually...

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:43

tc3j3r wrote:McLaren look like favourites to me at this stage but we'll all be watching to see what Fisichella does into turn 1 at the start...

... and Truli...

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:44

Pedro_Diniz wrote:
CarlosFerreira wrote:
Pedro_Diniz wrote:Turn 8

What? Why?

For giving us Piquet's double-whammy of reject offings in qualifying! I think it's an ironic reject award, actually...

It's got to a point no-one wants to nominate Piquet anymore, for fear of being considered unsporty... :mrgreen:

Pedro_Diniz · Post by **Pedro_Diniz** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:48

hehe.... listening to Coulthard and co. talking about him after Q1, I actually felt for him. He cut a sorry figure wandering around the back of the circuit with his Renault beached in the gravel.

Debaser · Post by **Debaser** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:50

Piquet blamed "Brake Faliure" for spinning off in Q1. Does anyone believe that? Also McLaren are hopeless, they're a strong reject of the year candidate.

Faustus · Post by **Faustus** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:50

This far, definitely Lewis Hamilton.

Pedro_Diniz · Post by **Pedro_Diniz** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:52

Debaser wrote:Piquet blamed "driver error" for spinning off in Q1. Does anyone believe that?

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 06 Jun 2009, 12:54

Debaser wrote:Piquet blamed "Brake Faliure" for spinning off in Q1. Does anyone believe that?

I don't think Flav has resorted to severing brake lines yet. Perhaps he meant "brake failure" as in "I failed to brake in time"?

hclw · Post by **hclw** » 06 Jun 2009, 13:20

Piquet did well in qualifying apart from sliding off the road twice, getting stuck in a gravel pit, failing to qualify for Q2 and trudging back to the pits a lonely man lost in a sea of misery and despair. Apart from that, he did alright.

Glock was miles off his team mate, maybe he should be reject of the race and not that nice, handsome Nelson Piquet

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 06 Jun 2009, 13:23

Given that Piquet was running pretty strongly in the third practice session - he was a second quicker than Alonso - I'd say the brake failures were legit.

DonTirri · Post by **DonTirri** » 06 Jun 2009, 15:47

Captain Hammer wrote:Given that Piquet was running pretty strongly in the third practice session - he was a second quicker than Alonso - I'd say the brake failures were legit.

Aye, especially if you heard the radiotransmission he got right after spinning.

It went basically like this:

Nelson: Something broke!
Team: We know, we noticed it when you last pitted. It was just a matter of time.

Popi_Larrauri · Post by **Popi_Larrauri** » 06 Jun 2009, 16:30

Nin13 wrote:Its too early to say. But but after qualifying it looks like Mclaren are really wanting this award.
Hamilton could not make part Q1 and Mclaren seem to be slower than even Force India. They will have to something spectacular to not get the award.

I'm in!

Popi_Larrauri · Post by **Popi_Larrauri** » 06 Jun 2009, 16:32

DonTirri wrote:
Captain Hammer wrote:Given that Piquet was running pretty strongly in the third practice session - he was a second quicker than Alonso - I'd say the brake failures were legit.

Aye, especially if you heard the radiotransmission he got right after spinning.

It went basically like this:

Nelson: Something broke!
Team: We know, we noticed it when you last pitted. It was just a matter of time.

Well, i'm still for Hamilton for ROTR, but Renault mechanics are starting to act monteverdi-AndreaModa like, isn't it?

nit · Post by **nit** » 06 Jun 2009, 17:00

Piquet as the only person this weeken to spin and find the gravel trap lol sooo far he the rotr

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 06 Jun 2009, 17:08

DonTirri wrote:
Captain Hammer wrote:Given that Piquet was running pretty strongly in the third practice session - he was a second quicker than Alonso - I'd say the brake failures were legit.

Aye, especially if you heard the radiotransmission he got right after spinning.

It went basically like this:

Nelson: Something broke!
Team: We know, we noticed it when you last pitted. It was just a matter of time.

Man, if that's true I am voting for the Renault team! You don't send a pilot out with something broken in the brakes, do you?

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 06 Jun 2009, 19:10

CarlosFerreira wrote:
DonTirri wrote:
Captain Hammer wrote:Given that Piquet was running pretty strongly in the third practice session - he was a second quicker than Alonso - I'd say the brake failures were legit.

Aye, especially if you heard the radiotransmission he got right after spinning.

It went basically like this:

Nelson: Something broke!
Team: We know, we noticed it when you last pitted. It was just a matter of time.

Man, if that's true I am voting for the Renault team! You don't send a pilot out with something broken in the brakes, do you?

You do if you're Andrea Moda.

RejectSteve · Post by **RejectSteve** » 06 Jun 2009, 20:11

BlindCaveSalamander wrote:
CarlosFerreira wrote:Man, if that's true I am voting for the Renault team! You don't send a pilot out with something broken in the brakes, do you?

You do if you're Andrea Moda.

Does this mean that the police will finally arrest Flavio with Renault subsequently banned from the championship for bringing the sport into disrepute?

thehemogoblin · Post by **thehemogoblin** » 06 Jun 2009, 20:46

nit wrote:Piquet as the only person this weeken to spin and find the gravel trap lol sooo far he the rotr

It takes a lot of anti-talent to find the gravel in Turkey.

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 06 Jun 2009, 21:20

BlindCaveSalamander wrote:You do if you're Andrea Moda.

I know what you mean, but this is quite serious. If we do get to a point where a car has something broken, or at least bent, and the team allows the pilot out with the subsequent crash being attributed to that failure, it amounts to reckless management, at the very least. I don't want to mount a health-and-safety charge here, but Roland Ratzenberger had had an off that damaged the wing that subsequently broke off, with the consequences we all know. Of course, the team back then couldn't know; if Renault did know there was something wrong with Piquet's car, that's a different kettle of fish; if it is true, no wonder he's never quite confident in the car. I wouldn't be!

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 06 Jun 2009, 21:59

CarlosFerreira wrote:
BlindCaveSalamander wrote:You do if you're Andrea Moda.

I know what you mean, but this is quite serious. If we do get to a point where a car has something broken, or at least bent, and the team allows the pilot out with the subsequent crash being attributed to that failure, it amounts to reckless management, at the very least. I don't want to mount a health-and-safety charge here, but Roland Ratzenberger had had an off that damaged the wing that subsequently broke off, with the consequences we all know. Of course, the team back then couldn't know; if Renault did know there was something wrong with Piquet's car, that's a different kettle of fish; if it is true, no wonder he's never quite confident in the car. I wouldn't be!

Well, if that is the case, we should be hearing something about it in the race build-up tomorrow. I doubt that Renault would actually do something like that, it's monumentally reckless and stupid. For all the flak Piquet gets, and Flav's apathetic nature to him, this is something that should never happen.

If this rumour does turn out to be true, though, I second what you said - Renault for ROTR.

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 06 Jun 2009, 23:01

That's exactly the reason why I said "if it's true". I suppose there might be some miscommunication issue there, either between the team and Piquet, or on the transmission. I really can't believe it's as straight as it sounds. It would be too serious.

EDIT: Ther might be a simpler explanation. This is from the formula1.com website:

Renault
Fernando Alonso, 1m 29.075s, P8
Nelson Piquet, 1m 28.582s, P17
Alonso said that Q2 was really difficult and just scraped through to Q3 in 10th place. Piquet slid out of contention in Q1 when his R29 half spun in Turn 8, gripped, then understeered off the road. Subsequently in Q3, Alonso suffered the same fate, suggesting that the diffusers may have stalled when the cars bottomed over the bumps there.

http://www.formula1.com/news/features/2009/6/9465.html

It might just be a snappy aero problem. Let's see if there's more information on this issue coming through.

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 07 Jun 2009, 00:18

I'm going to nominate Fernando Alonso's strategist: once again, Alonso's fuel tank is as dry as a martini; it's the only way he can get into Q3. But instead of comporising him like that, how about he throws Q2 and puts the car somewhere like 11th or 12th next time, allowing for a much more flexible strategy?

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 07 Jun 2009, 01:12

Captain Hammer wrote:I'm going to nominate Fernando Alonso's strategist: once again, Alonso's fuel tank is as dry as a martini; it's the only way he can get into Q3. But instead of comporising him like that, how about he throws Q2 and puts the car somewhere like 11th or 12th next time, allowing for a much more flexible strategy?

What do you mean? Fuel loads only apply to Q3, in Q2 everyone runs on fumes. That's why the times there are faster. What Alonso could do is pull a Rosberg: qualify into Q3 and then use an oil-tanker load in Q3, start from 10th and run until the tyres explode.

RAK · Post by **RAK** » 07 Jun 2009, 13:29

Naomi Campbell: While stating that you want "England" to win is probably acceptable in general conversation, it isn't the cleverest thing to say to two BBC commentators who also happen to both be ex-Formula One drivers. I doubt she knows enough about motorsport to confuse it with A1, either.

Debaser · Post by **Debaser** » 07 Jun 2009, 13:34

Can we nominate the race as a whole? Pretty dull fare again. Also was it me or was Naomi Campbell either mad or pissed?

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 07 Jun 2009, 13:37

I might just vote for Barrichello. Beaten in qualifying despite less fuel, had the bad luck of almost stalling it at the start, and then went on barging people off until finally retiring. He had done the same in Oz, with a bit more luck, but he seems increasingly frustrated. As a result, he dropped a "there's too much bad luck going in my side of the garage, the team need to look this way" bomb in the BBC interview, even before the race was over. Really, with all that experience, you'd expect more. I don't recall Patrese doing this sort of things, ever.

LukeB · Post by **LukeB** » 07 Jun 2009, 13:53

Debaser wrote:Can we nominate the race as a whole? Pretty dull fare again. Also was it me or was Naomi Campbell either mad or pissed?

Oh I doubt it was anything to do with drink...

Give the prize to Barrichelo. Not all the problems were of his own making, but he was entirely responsible for clattering into Sutil and could well have ended both their races. Button keeps on winning while his teammate is nowhere with no team-orders to blame for holding him back anymore.

midgrid · Post by **midgrid** » 07 Jun 2009, 14:07

CarlosFerreira wrote:I might just vote for Barrichello. Beaten in qualifying despite less fuel, had the bad luck of almost stalling it at the start, and then went on barging people off until finally retiring. He had done the same in Oz, with a bit more luck, but he seems increasingly frustrated. As a result, he dropped a "there's too much bad luck going in my side of the garage, the team need to look this way" bomb in the BBC interview, even before the race was over. Really, with all that experience, you'd expect more. I don't recall Patrese doing this sort of things, ever.

I agree; my vote goes to Barrichello!

crazydude1992 · Post by **crazydude1992** » 07 Jun 2009, 14:34

Mine too.

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 07 Jun 2009, 15:20

Barrichello is the obvious choice, but I'm going to take an easy shot here and nominate Giancarlo Fisichella for yet another early exit from Istanbul.

Also, I have to say: that was a ballsy move by Piquet on Hamilton down into the final complex, and it certainly one I wasn't expecting him to see pull off. Probably one of the best moves all year.

Ridge Racer · Post by **Ridge Racer** » 07 Jun 2009, 16:00

I have to go with Piquet because he just doesn't seem to want to try to be anything more than mediocre.

I think that Barrichello has a little bit of a right to complain and feel frustrated about the way he is sometimes treated, in seventeen years of F1 racing he's either been the lead driver in teams that weren't going anywhere at the time or has been forced to play second fiddle to another driver when he was in a good team (Ferrari, Brawn).

I get that Button is Brawn's #1 driver but that doesn't mean they should treat Barrichello differently or try to sabotage his efforts when he has the obvious advantage over his teammate (this year at Spain) its exactly the same kind of treatment he received when he was partnered with Schumacher at Ferrari (and Ross Brawn was running that team too) so he has every right to feel frustrated and angry with his team.

If I recall Ricardo Patrese walked out on Benetton in 1993 because he felt threatened by Micheal Schumacher's obvious talent in the drivers seat.

Post by **Nuppiz** » 07 Jun 2009, 17:55

Barrichello - Almost stalled and dropped to the back; then fought too hard with Kovalainen and spun; after a while, hit another rear wheel, this time Sutil's, breaking his front wing; after replacing his wing, drove some laps right at the back before pulling his car in the pitbox and retired. Pretty much ROTR for me.

Piquet escapes my nomination for ROTR thanks to his awesome maneuvre against Hamilton.

Ross Prawn · Post by **Ross Prawn** » 07 Jun 2009, 19:24

Rubens is a strong contender, totally cocked up race, and resorted to touring car driver tactics. But maybe he should be let off for entertaining us.

Maybe, Renault for producing a car that was so bad that Alonso could only just beat Piquet.

Bourdais was stunningly poor too, but maybe thats too obvious.

I think I'd nominate 'World Champions' as Lewis, Kimi and Alonso all had shocking days, and all seemed to give up.