2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

The place for speaking your mind on current goings-on in F1
User avatar
Paul Hayes
Posts: 1104
Joined: 17 Apr 2009, 19:54

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Paul Hayes »

It never quite lived up to the excitement of the first lap or two, but well done to Rosberg, Grosjean and Wehrlein.
sswishbone
Posts: 1157
Joined: 25 Mar 2011, 06:23
Location: England

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by sswishbone »

Fantastic for Vandorne to score on debut, massive result for Mclaren

Brilliant from Grosjean, so aggressive pit strategy but so great on the track
"Hispania are a waste of talent and petrol!" Martin Brundle, Australia Qualifying 2011

Live streams and podcasts from yours truly at http://www.youtube.com/user/sswishbone
User avatar
UncreativeUsername37
Posts: 3420
Joined: 25 May 2012, 14:36
Location: Earth

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by UncreativeUsername37 »

I like this season.
Rob Dylan wrote:Mercedes paying homage to the other W12 chassis by breaking down 30 minutes in
User avatar
sw3ishida
Posts: 84
Joined: 15 Apr 2014, 15:36

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by sw3ishida »

Until we see him again, Vandoorne's single point will remain on the board as "the little point that could".
User avatar
Miguel98
Posts: 2450
Joined: 30 Mar 2014, 09:18
Location: Somewhere in Portugal

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Miguel98 »

Great race, great commentators.. All is well in Portugal in F1. :)

Great drive by Rosberg. Calm, measured. A different Nico so far this year.
Mario on Gutierrez after the Italian Grand Prix wrote:He's no longer just a bit of a tool, he's the entire tool set.


18-07-2015: Forever in our hearts Jules.
25-08-2015: Forever in our hearts Justin.
User avatar
Aguaman
Posts: 669
Joined: 22 Sep 2014, 15:16

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Aguaman »

Oh that's a nice trophy
User avatar
mario
Posts: 8114
Joined: 31 Oct 2009, 17:13

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by mario »

Paul Hayes wrote:I don't want to jinx anything, but - based on absolutely nothing whatsoever - I am optimistic that Hamilton won't win today. Admittedly, Rosberg repeatedly winning would quickly become as dull as Hamilton walking away with the title, but hopefully Ferrari can not shoot themselves in the foot this week and take the fight for the win right to the end of the race and make it exciting.

That engine blowout has rather undercut Vettel's charge this season, and it's a rather bad sign for both drivers that they have had two mechanical failures in back to back races (not to mention the issues that their customers are having as well). Even if Ferrari are closer in terms of raw pace, those reliability issues are doing significant damage to their title aspirations.
Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
User avatar
Aislabie
Posts: 1964
Joined: 14 Feb 2016, 11:06

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Aislabie »

Unbelievable scenes - two successive superb Grands Prix!
User avatar
Miguel98
Posts: 2450
Joined: 30 Mar 2014, 09:18
Location: Somewhere in Portugal

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Miguel98 »

mario wrote:
Paul Hayes wrote:I don't want to jinx anything, but - based on absolutely nothing whatsoever - I am optimistic that Hamilton won't win today. Admittedly, Rosberg repeatedly winning would quickly become as dull as Hamilton walking away with the title, but hopefully Ferrari can not shoot themselves in the foot this week and take the fight for the win right to the end of the race and make it exciting.

That engine blowout has rather undercut Vettel's charge this season, and it's a rather bad sign for both drivers that they have had two mechanical failures in back to back races (not to mention the issues that their customers are having as well). Even if Ferrari are closer in terms of raw pace, those reliability issues are doing significant damage to their title aspirations.


Ferrari are already going to bring a update turbocharger unit to Catalunya. If it's an upgrade on performance wise or reliability wise.. We'll have to wait.
Mario on Gutierrez after the Italian Grand Prix wrote:He's no longer just a bit of a tool, he's the entire tool set.


18-07-2015: Forever in our hearts Jules.
25-08-2015: Forever in our hearts Justin.
User avatar
Dj_bereta
Posts: 1513
Joined: 30 Aug 2009, 15:55

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Dj_bereta »

The first thing that comes to my mind after the race finish is: Button is in big pressure now. Okay, his car broken in the race, but Vandoorne qualified ahead of him and scored the first point for McLaren in this season.

In just one race Vandoorne delivered more than people are expecting. I can't imagine McLaren keeping Button for another year after this superb performance of Vandoorne.
Waiting for Lotus hiring Johnny Cecotto jr.
User avatar
AndreaModa
Posts: 5806
Joined: 30 Mar 2009, 17:51
Location: Bristol, UK

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by AndreaModa »

Good race, crazy first few laps, brilliant to see Haas and Manor competitive too. I bet Sauber were screaming at Ericsson at the end to keep Wehrlein behind him. That 12th place could prove to be important!
I want my MTV...Simtek Ford

My Motorsport Photos

@DNPQ_
User avatar
Miguel98
Posts: 2450
Joined: 30 Mar 2014, 09:18
Location: Somewhere in Portugal

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Miguel98 »



Now, this comes as a surprise. There's some potential in that car...
Mario on Gutierrez after the Italian Grand Prix wrote:He's no longer just a bit of a tool, he's the entire tool set.


18-07-2015: Forever in our hearts Jules.
25-08-2015: Forever in our hearts Justin.
User avatar
flattyre
Posts: 13
Joined: 25 Nov 2013, 23:36
Location: Shatfield

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by flattyre »

At this rate, I'm wondering if Haas will be able to sneak onto the podium at some point this year. It'll take a race with a good chunk of retirements, but I see no reason why they couldn't if they keep this pace up with Grosjean.

Positively surprised by the performance of Stoffel "Van Door", as I like to call him :deletraz:

Oh, and I've cast my obligatory driver of the day vote to the unstoppable Rio Haryanto. The question is... have you?
User avatar
mario
Posts: 8114
Joined: 31 Oct 2009, 17:13

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by mario »

Miguel98 wrote:
mario wrote:
Paul Hayes wrote:I don't want to jinx anything, but - based on absolutely nothing whatsoever - I am optimistic that Hamilton won't win today. Admittedly, Rosberg repeatedly winning would quickly become as dull as Hamilton walking away with the title, but hopefully Ferrari can not shoot themselves in the foot this week and take the fight for the win right to the end of the race and make it exciting.

That engine blowout has rather undercut Vettel's charge this season, and it's a rather bad sign for both drivers that they have had two mechanical failures in back to back races (not to mention the issues that their customers are having as well). Even if Ferrari are closer in terms of raw pace, those reliability issues are doing significant damage to their title aspirations.


Ferrari are already going to bring a update turbocharger unit to Catalunya. If it's an upgrade on performance wise or reliability wise.. We'll have to wait.

It sounds as if Ferrari might well need to bring in an update to boost their reliability - whilst it seems that their peak power is comparable with Mercedes when they run their power unit in its most aggressive power setting, they cannot sustain a comparable power output in race mode without compromising the reliability of their unit.

In Vettel's case, though, it looks like it might have been a different component failure this time around, with Arrivabene indicating that it was a fuel injection system failure or an intake valve failure being the most likely culprits (though a full analysis hasn't been completed).

flattyre wrote:At this rate, I'm wondering if Haas will be able to sneak onto the podium at some point this year. It'll take a race with a good chunk of retirements, but I see no reason why they couldn't if they keep this pace up with Grosjean.

Positively surprised by the performance of Stoffel "Van Door", as I like to call him :deletraz:

Oh, and I've cast my obligatory driver of the day vote to the unstoppable Rio Haryanto. The question is... have you?

I don't think it is impossible that we could see Haas make it onto the podium - we saw that Grosjean had an outside chance of beating Ricciardo today and, had Hamilton suffered enough damage to force him out of the race, a podium finish could well have been up for grabs.

The VF-16 does seem to be rather kind on its tyres and works quite well on the softer compounds, and overall the car does seem to be quite nicely balanced. It would take a slightly favourable set of circumstances, but with Renault not expected to bring in a major update until Canada and Ferrari bringing their own updates in Spain, plus Williams currently struggling with their new front wing and nose assembly, Haas could potentially take advantage of the current weakness of some of their rivals if Mercedes and Ferrari falter.
Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
User avatar
good_Ralf
Posts: 2681
Joined: 06 Jun 2013, 13:14
Location: Hitchin, UK

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by good_Ralf »

I’ve been using Microsoft Excel to create some spreadsheets which use lap time data from races.
One of the spreadsheets I made calculates the fastest fuel-adjusted lap for each driver.
From what I can gather, one extra lap of fuel costs about 0.05s (which differs from the 0.1s that someone mentioned earlier) in lap time on a typical Tilkedrome, so I plugged that figure into my spreadsheet.
I didn't take the fastest lap standings and apply my formulae to that, the spreadsheet (one for each driver) works out the fuel-adjusted lap time for every lap in a driver's race.

This is the top 10 in the fuel-adjusted fastest lap standings:

1) Hamilton - 1:33.2
2) Rosberg - 0.366
3) Raikkonen - 0.827
4) Perez - 1.233
5) Kvyat - 1.288
6) Wehrlein - 1.442
7) Grosjean - 1.629
8) Ricciardo - 1.679
9) Nasr - 1.684
10) Hulkenberg - 1.732

I created another spreadsheet which for each lap, calculates the aggregate time for the previous 5 laps of a driver's race. I inserted the laptimes into the spreadsheet and the fastest 5 lap stint in a driver’s race appears in an adjacent table. Some drivers can be quick over a single lap but not over a number of laps, I think a 5 lap stint is a good indicator as how good a driver is at speed and consistency during a race.

I did a spreadsheet using the laps for today's race in Bahrain and first, I worked out what the fuel-adjusted laps were, then I applied them to the 5LS spreadsheet.
So Lewis Hamilton put in the fastest 5 lap stint of the race (fuel-adjusted). The list below shows how fast the other drivers were on average over a fuel-adjusted 5LS compared to Hamilton.

1) Hamilton
2) Raikkonen - 0.311
3) Rosberg - 0.434
4) Verstappen - 1.232
5) Perez - 1.516
6) Ricciardo - 1.595
7) Grosjean - 1.709
8) Kvyat - 1.727
9) Hulkenberg - 1.967
10) Nasr - 2.099
Massa - 2.111
Wehrlein - 2.140
Bottas - 2.160
Vandoorne - 2.408
Haryanto - 2.492
Gutierrez - 2.601
Button - 2.746
Magnussen - 2.789
Ericsson - 2.837
Sainz - 3.125

In any case, take these hastily-made figures with a pinch of salt.
Check out the position of the sun on 2 August at 20:08 in my garden

Allard Kalff in 1994 wrote:OH!! Schumacher in the wall! Right in front of us, Michael Schumacher is in the wall! He's hit the pitwall, he c... Ah, it's Jos Verstappen.
User avatar
Frentzen127
Posts: 414
Joined: 01 Apr 2009, 17:32

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Frentzen127 »

If you have all the fuel adjusted lap times for each driver, could you sort them all from fastest to slowest, and plot histograms for each? We might be able to learn a thing or two from their probability distributions, just a thought.
DEPORTIVO CA... pfft hahaha can't say that with a straight face!
Misses Minardi dearly. :(
User avatar
CoopsII
Posts: 4676
Joined: 15 Dec 2011, 09:33
Location: Starkiller Base Debris

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by CoopsII »

flattyre wrote:Oh, and I've cast my obligatory driver of the day vote to the unstoppable Rio Haryanto. The question is... have you?

Certainly, and I cast into eternal damnation anybody from the forum who dared to vote for one of the front runners!

A great race but it could've been a classic were it not for Vettel stopping and Hamilton being Bott-assed. Nice to see Rosberg building a healthy lead but I'd like to see him deal with some pressure from Vettel.

I missed the Aussie qualifying so it was all new to me this weekend and I wasn't particularly impressed. I found myself watching the graphic counting down beside each name rather then the on-track action. It might have helped if the on-track action focused on who was facing elimination but half the time they were sat in the garage so what can the director do? It was all a bit disjointed, to me.
Just For One Day...
AxelP800
Posts: 1372
Joined: 29 Mar 2013, 16:01

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by AxelP800 »

Am I the only one who enjoy those sparks? I mean it added a sense of speed.
Rio Haryanto for the win!
He upon seeing me accidentaly paint Belgian flag rotated 90 deg to right
tommykl returns from the bathroom
tommykl reads the chat logs
tommykl has a stroke
User avatar
DanielPT
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 6126
Joined: 30 Dec 2010, 18:44
Location: Porto, Portugal

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by DanielPT »

I think it was a decent race with lots of fights in the midfield and awesome MRT coverage! It all came through for a relaxed late afternoon victory for Rosberg. Ferrari is indeed closer to Mercedes than at this time last year, yet like the pre season test indicated, it was at the cost of reliability. Whether they will solve it in time for them to mount a serious championship title campaign remains to be seen, but so far things aren't looking good. Haas and Grosjean kept their fairy tale start to the season but I can only feel for Gutierrez that, through no fault of his own, is having the brunt of Haas bad luck barely participating in both races. Besides the coverage, Wehrlein also had a stonker of a race and certainly is showing is DTM champion credentials. He is carrying the MRT fight to the lower midfield in an amazing fashion and I must admit that he is winning me over with his heroics. Hope to see much more of him this season. Of course all of this came at the cost of someone. Force India had an horrendous race. If I am not mistaken Hulk was, from all the finishing drivers, the one who lost most positions in the race. The owners shenanigans in India catching up with the team? If so, it is a shame. And it would be more of a shame if Sauber were to disappear from F1 if such rumors are true. It was also poor for them although they at least had some coverage and were, at some point, flirting with the points. Another team that disappointed was Williams. They have the one lap pace, but strategy wise, they are still behind. They went to mediums and probably that hurt their race as much as Bottas dive in the first corner. A final shout to Vandoorne who had a good race and managed to score the first points for McLaren. Oh the irony!
Colin Kolles on F111, 2011 HRT challenger: The car doesn't look too bad; it looks like a modern F1 car.
User avatar
Aislabie
Posts: 1964
Joined: 14 Feb 2016, 11:06

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Aislabie »

I'm just going to leave this quote here from a 2001 F1 Season preview:

Aforementioned season preview wrote:Achilles Heel: Poor race strategy has lost Williams several races in the past.
User avatar
WeirdKerr
Posts: 1864
Joined: 05 Apr 2009, 15:57
Location: on the edge of nowhere with a ludicrous grid penalty.....

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by WeirdKerr »

Aislabie wrote:I'm just going to leave this quote here from a 2001 F1 Season preview:

Aforementioned season preview wrote:Achilles Heel: Poor race strategy has lost Williams several races in the past.


I remember watching during 1995 when there were a few races that Williams lost due to poor(or overly conservative) fuel/tyre strategy....
User avatar
Dj_bereta
Posts: 1513
Joined: 30 Aug 2009, 15:55

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Dj_bereta »

WeirdKerr wrote:
Aislabie wrote:I'm just going to leave this quote here from a 2001 F1 Season preview:

Aforementioned season preview wrote:Achilles Heel: Poor race strategy has lost Williams several races in the past.


I remember watching during 1995 when there were a few races that Williams lost due to poor(or overly conservative) fuel/tyre strategy....


And the infamous strategy for Monaco Grand Prix of 1997 season starting with dry tyres in a wet track.
Waiting for Lotus hiring Johnny Cecotto jr.
User avatar
flattyre
Posts: 13
Joined: 25 Nov 2013, 23:36
Location: Shatfield

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by flattyre »

AxelP800 wrote:Am I the only one who enjoy those sparks? I mean it added a sense of speed.


Nope, you're not the only one. I love them. I remember wishing for them to come back during the Schumacher era, I even thought about setting up a petition to return to titanium skid blocks around about 2005. I can't tell you how chuffed I was when they returned. :)
User avatar
DanielPT
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 6126
Joined: 30 Dec 2010, 18:44
Location: Porto, Portugal

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by DanielPT »

flattyre wrote:
AxelP800 wrote:Am I the only one who enjoy those sparks? I mean it added a sense of speed.


Nope, you're not the only one. I love them. I remember wishing for them to come back during the Schumacher era, I even thought about setting up a petition to return to titanium skid blocks around about 2005. I can't tell you how chuffed I was when they returned. :)


The problem for me with the sparks these days are the reason for their introduction. It is no longer a consequence of the car, but it is a way, a gimmick, to improve the show. I now find them distracting and somewhat ridiculous.

Look! Sparks! They're shiny!

Image
:P
Colin Kolles on F111, 2011 HRT challenger: The car doesn't look too bad; it looks like a modern F1 car.
User avatar
RonDenisDeletraz
Posts: 7380
Joined: 27 Oct 2011, 08:21
Location: Flight 643
Contact:

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by RonDenisDeletraz »

I quite like the sparks, it is a bit gimmicky but that is not unusual for modern F1
aerond wrote:Yes RDD, but we always knew you never had any sort of taste either :P

tommykl wrote:I have a shite car and meme sponsors, but Corrado Fabi will carry me to the promised land with the power of Lionel Richie.
User avatar
Nuppiz
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 5942
Joined: 30 Mar 2009, 12:10
Location: Vantaa, Finland
Contact:

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Nuppiz »

The sparks are fine, but I think they've gone overboard with them. Every car is regularly spewing out sparks as if they were driving on rims alone, making it too obvious they're deliberatedly added in instead of being an accidental consequence of how the car is built. Sometimes less is more, and I wouldn't mind if they reduced them to at least half of the current amount.

By the way, in a sport where thousandths of a second are important, just how much is the scraping effect slowing down the cars?
Eurosport broadcast for the 1990 Mexican GP prequalifying:
"The Life, it looked very lifeless yet again... in fact Bruno did one, slow lap"
User avatar
Ataxia
Not Important
Posts: 6861
Joined: 23 Jun 2010, 12:47
Location: Sneed's Feed & Seed (formerly Chuck's)
Contact:

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Ataxia »

They're not gimmicky though, the titanium was introduced to replace the metals previously used in the skid block which would fragment and potentially cause some damage. Since titanium is lighter, there's a reduced possibility of this. Furthermore, titanium is "softer" than say, steel, so it's more prone to wearing out. Teams need to run their cars higher in order to manage that wear before it affects the wooden skid block.

Sparks are a side-effect of the titanium being used, but F1 presumably marketed it as "sparks? SHINY! LOOK!" for the large casual fanbase who don't care about materials engineering.
Mitch Hedberg wrote:I want to be a race car passenger: just a guy who bugs the driver. Say man, can I turn on the radio? You should slow down. Why do we gotta keep going in circles? Man, you really like Tide...
User avatar
DanielPT
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 6126
Joined: 30 Dec 2010, 18:44
Location: Porto, Portugal

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by DanielPT »

Ataxia wrote:They're not gimmicky though, the titanium was introduced to replace the metals previously used in the skid block which would fragment and potentially cause some damage. Since titanium is lighter, there's a reduced possibility of this. Furthermore, titanium is "softer" than say, steel, so it's more prone to wearing out. Teams need to run their cars higher in order to manage that wear before it affects the wooden skid block.

Sparks are a side-effect of the titanium being used, but F1 presumably marketed it as "sparks? SHINY! LOOK!" for the large casual fanbase who don't care about materials engineering.


That was the explanation they did for the change. That it was for safety and technical reasons. People around F1, including teams, discussed it as a improvement to the show and apparently the real reason was to placate cheating (i.e. running the car lower to the ground because the skid plates protected the plank from excessive wear) from one unnamed but easily guessable team. So, it all still seems a gimmick in my opinion regardless of the real reason.
Colin Kolles on F111, 2011 HRT challenger: The car doesn't look too bad; it looks like a modern F1 car.
User avatar
Wallio
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 2630
Joined: 22 Feb 2012, 22:54
Location: The Wyoming Valley, PA

Re: 2016 Bahrain Grand Prix

Post by Wallio »

DanielPT wrote:
That was the explanation they did for the change. That it was for safety and technical reasons. People around F1, including teams, discussed it as a improvement to the show and apparently the real reason was to placate cheating (i.e. running the car lower to the ground because the skid plates protected the plank from excessive wear) from one unnamed but easily guessable team. So, it all still seems a gimmick in my opinion regardless of the real reason.



Ah, for probably the first time in 1 history, that sentence has been written about a team other than Ferrari. I feel older by the day. :P
Professional Historian/Retired Drag Racer/Whiskey Enthusiast

"He makes the move on the outside, and knowing George as we do, he's probably on the radio right now telling the team how great he is." - James Hinchcliffe on George Russell
Post Reply