Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

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patrick
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by patrick »

Shizuka wrote:
mediocre wrote:
Glennerz wrote:Image

What's that? Proton entering WTCC?


It's an old BTCC pic from 2002.


That jigs a memory. I remember going to Donington in 2002 and walking down the pits and getting the autographs of the drivers of that car!
Well I think it was them (I was 12) - or the similarly liveried (Egg finance?) Vauxhall Astra. I think I still have them somewhere. The series was really fun back then IIRC.

Anyway, enough BTCC - it seems TL may keep the green and yellow for now - according to a not entirely scientific twitter poll by mike gascoyne

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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Ferrim »

Whatever they are called and whatever livery they are running next year, I know who will I be rooting for.

Come on 1Malaysia Racing Team!

Go home, Col... I mean, Dany Bahar!
Go home, Bernie Ecclestone!

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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Shizuka »

But it's not fair!

1Malaysia brought Lotus in! THEY should recieve the black & gold colour scheme! And Renault should get British Racing Green & yellow!

Code: Select all

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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Yannick »

Having Benetton renamed and rebranded as Lotus feels just wrong. But Honda could turn into Mercedes as well recently. So what's next? Toro Rosso turning into Pepsi Racing?
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by F1000X »

Image

The gold needs to be WAY brighter.

I feel for Tony Fernandes, this is bulls***. As usual, politics are ruining Formula 1.

Image

And what the hell is this thing? Because it looks like a MkIV Volkswagen Jetta in disguise.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by watka »

F1000X wrote:
Image

And what the hell is this thing? Because it looks like a MkIV Volkswagen Jetta in disguise.


It's a Proton Impian, silly.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by noisebox »

I have to go against the grain here. I'm surprised by the outpouring of sympathy for Tony Fernandes - he was entering F1 last year as Lotus or otherwise. All he has done is opportunistically nicked one of the great brands in British motorsport to generate unmeritted publicity for his new outfit. He has no links to the original Team Lotus whatsoever.

Proton, on the other hand have invested millions into Group Lotus, arguably saving them from becomming the next TVR. They have a legitimate right to leverage that investment by using the Lotus brand (which they own) to promote their cars through motorsport activities worldwide. They have also bought into and secured the future of one of the great contemporary F1 teams.

Foreign / corporate ownership of premium or sportscar brands is not new - Bentley, Bugatti and Lamborghini have all had their futures secured by investment from VAG, Fiat have long bankrolled Ferrari and without BMW Rolls Royce would no longer be making cars in any form. Sure it's not ideal, but there are so few surviving, small automotive manufacturers that we should cherish those that have been saved by external investment - it shows there is value to their brands.

The sensible way out of this is for Group Lotus/Proton to pay off Fernandes so that he can carry on growing his outfit, whilst the Lotus name is associated with a company which makes fantastic sports cars.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by James1978 »

Don't really know what I think of all this to be honest except that it really confuses me, and also it makes a mess of the idea I had for my next alternative championship! :)
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Aerospeed »

The Light blue and white is somewhat reminiscent to Sauber '05...

And the red on the Renault looks WAAY out of place! Fix this PLEASE!
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Cynon »

Sorry, I just saw the new Renault livery and died inside, because that livery looks horrendous on a current-generation F1 car. It actually didn't look so bad on an Indycar because it's a bit boxier. It really saddens me because it puts an end to my favorite F1 livery in a long time. Oh well, it wouldn't be F1 if teams didn't immediately throw away good liveries for shite ones and make shite liveries shittier. :( (Also, that Proton Impian livery needs to die in a fire as well)

This whole deal is filled with a bunch of idiots who are trying to associate themselves with a famous name, because if Tony Fernandes didn't try and use the Lotus name, nobody outside Malaysia (or this site) would have cared about his team. It reeks of people trying to "defend" the legacy of the Lotus name and in the process are just tarring it further. This is what you get in F1 when people want to see current teams use old team names or 'revive' old traditions -- people like Fernandes and Group Lotus.

To be honest I would rather see Fernandes carry the Lotus name only because there's a greater probability that his Team Lotus will suck. But has anyone else considered that Renault is supplying Fernandes's team with Renault engines as well? Hmmm? We effectively have two Lotus Renault teams. Anyone think that Renault is in position to act as moderator here?
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Salamander »

noisebox wrote:Proton, on the other hand have invested millions into Group Lotus, arguably saving them from becomming the next TVR. They have a legitimate right to leverage that investment by using the Lotus brand (which they own) to promote their cars through motorsport activities worldwide. They have also bought into and secured the future of one of the great contemporary F1 teams.

Foreign / corporate ownership of premium or sportscar brands is not new - Bentley, Bugatti and Lamborghini have all had their futures secured by investment from VAG, Fiat have long bankrolled Ferrari and without BMW Rolls Royce would no longer be making cars in any form. Sure it's not ideal, but there are so few surviving, small automotive manufacturers that we should cherish those that have been saved by external investment - it shows there is value to their brands.


To be frank, I do not give a damn about Group Lotus and what Proton have done to revive them. It is a separate entity to Team Lotus. Proton were content to focus on Group Lotus and do nothing about getting Team Lotus back up and running until David Hunt was talking about selling the name to someone else. Not doing anything about Team Lotus is fine, it's not their obligation to get the team running again, but what really confuses and infuriates me is that they were at least indifferent to Lotus Racing when it started, but as soon as Tony Fernandes wanted to call the team Team Lotus, oh no, that was completely unacceptable. It's completely illogical why they have a problem now - if they were worried about the name being tarnished, why didn't they intervene when the team was first announced? The only conclusion I can come to is that they seem to think the Team Lotus name is theirs. Which is actually what they thought when they first bought Group Lotus.

To me, this whole fiasco makes Proton look like they're some child covering their ears every time someone says that they don't own the Team Lotus name. For anyone to do this, it looks childish and immature. But for a company part-owned by the Malaysian government? It makes me feel embarrassed to share a planet with people intelligent enough to run a company, yet who also find a way to be completely and utterly stupid.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Myrvold »

Noisebox, the only one who have connection to the Team Lotus is Chapmans family, they don't have the chance to revive the team. Group Lotus have no connections to Lotus in F1 at all.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by eagleash »

noisebox wrote:I have to go against the grain here. I'm surprised by the outpouring of sympathy for Tony Fernandes - he was entering F1 last year as Lotus or otherwise. All he has done is opportunistically nicked one of the great brands in British motorsport to generate unmeritted publicity for his new outfit. He has no links to the original Team Lotus whatsoever.



There may be some validity in that point of view, but it was a good strategic decision by Fernandes, who in taking over the Litespeed entry inherited some former Lotus personnel. He sought & obtained the blessing of the Chapman Family as well as the late Peter Warr (who ran the team after Colin Chapman passed away). Clive Chapman even passed Fernandes his Father's famous black cap which he used to hurl into the air when his cars won. So it is not just opportunistic (even if a good "business" decision) but respect for the team & it's traditions has been demonstrated.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by mario »

noisebox wrote:I have to go against the grain here. I'm surprised by the outpouring of sympathy for Tony Fernandes - he was entering F1 last year as Lotus or otherwise. All he has done is opportunistically nicked one of the great brands in British motorsport to generate unmeritted publicity for his new outfit. He has no links to the original Team Lotus whatsoever.

Proton, on the other hand have invested millions into Group Lotus, arguably saving them from becomming the next TVR. They have a legitimate right to leverage that investment by using the Lotus brand (which they own) to promote their cars through motorsport activities worldwide. They have also bought into and secured the future of one of the great contemporary F1 teams.

Foreign / corporate ownership of premium or sportscar brands is not new - Bentley, Bugatti and Lamborghini have all had their futures secured by investment from VAG, Fiat have long bankrolled Ferrari and without BMW Rolls Royce would no longer be making cars in any form. Sure it's not ideal, but there are so few surviving, small automotive manufacturers that we should cherish those that have been saved by external investment - it shows there is value to their brands.

The sensible way out of this is for Group Lotus/Proton to pay off Fernandes so that he can carry on growing his outfit, whilst the Lotus name is associated with a company which makes fantastic sports cars.

I think that part of the reason why Fernandes has been so popular is because his team has been so open - being at the back of the grid, the team currently doesn't have anything worth copying on their car, so it doesn't really matter if they invite the journalists in and let them poke around the car.
Gascoyne, for example, did a number of pieces for the BBC, where he talked about diffuser design, shared information about weather conditions and strategy, and generally let people have a much closer look into the heart of the team. He also did a few technical pieces for the Lotus Racing website, where he talked about the design and construction of a few components (for example, about how they make the elements for the front wing), before showing off the new wing for the T127's first major upgrade package. When getting information from other teams is frankly almost impossible at times, to be so open and relaxed is a refreshing change. Also, Heikki and Jarno have been, relatively speaking, pretty remarkable as drivers - both know that their car is uncompetitive, and so there is no real acrimony between them - and both drivers have pulled out some impressive drives this year, especially Heikki (albeit aided by attrition).

Now, although we have not seen how Group Lotus will work with the wider motorsport community, I somehow doubt that they will be anywhere near as friendly. For a start, Group Lotus are only going into the sport for the money; Bahar made it clear that this is all about trying to increase the value of Group Lotus's brand, with the discussion turning on what entering F1 will do for the company on the corporate level. Wit the best will in the world, it is hard to be quite as sympathetic towards a corporation compared to the more personal approach that Lotus Racing have taken. Besides, there is the issue of trust; people are less inclined to support an organisation which has put out statements in the past which were, at best, of debatable accuracy, and at worst deliberately misleading.

As for the efforts of Proton, whilst it cannot be denied that up until recently they have kept Group Lotus going, and kept reasonably close to the original ethos of the company (small, lightweight and nimble cars), I am wondering with increasing concern that their future plans could backfire badly. Ever since Bahar took over control of the company, he has tried to push Lotus in a very different direction, having made it clear that he wants to take on his former employers at Ferrari. The thing is, recently Lotus haven't been doing that well, and the plans that Bahar has - more than doubling the range of cars, and pushing the average price tag up substantially - have been met with scepticism from the wider automotive community.

Already the companies current ventures into more premium markets have not gone well - Group Lotus have missed their sales targets for the Evora, and are unlikely to make up any ground. The problem is, as many reviewers have noted, the Evora is potentially more expensive compared to its rivals, especially the Porsche Boxter, and yet the build quality simply cannot match that of its rivals. The motorsport plans are even more ambitious - getting involved in virtually every form of motorsport, from GT cars and Le Mans to F1 and GP2, the commitments are considerable, and so will be the price tag. It all feels like it is too much, too fast, and can only end badly - and where the money for such a scheme will come is not apparent at all.

By the way, I hope that you don't object to this critique - I respect the fact that you're taking a different stance, and that you are willing to support it, even if others might not.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by WeirdKerr »

this is not gonna end well is it......
inmho its a bit of a malaysian/french and possibly abysinian clusterbathplug......
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by patrick »

mario wrote:...the commitments are considerable, and so will be the price tag. It all feels like it is too much, too fast, and can only end badly - and where the money for such a scheme will come is not apparent at all.


This is the biggest problem that I have with GL getting involved with "the Enstone team".
While TL/1Malaysia will probably not match GL's F1 budget, they will have constant financial security as Tony's business flourishes - which it certainly is. On the other hand, as you just said, GL/Proton are not so financially secure at the moment. And while GL has ambitious plans, Toleman/Benetton/Renault - the Enstone team - has certainly done well in the last year and it would be a shame to see them laid waste because of bad business.
I think Bahar's plans will fail, and sadly, the team will go down too. I still do not understand why Renault did not choose to buy back into the team after such a successful 2010.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Phoenix »

Personally, I love the new livery, it looks really well assorted in my opinion. However, I wholeheartedly disagree with Proton's and Dany Bahar's point of view. Especially since I'm a huge Team Lotus fan. This is a truly reject history in the making and will end in tears. Oh, and I'm seeing Vitaly Petrov's seat in danger too, which would be a shame.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by dinizintheoven »

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http://www.saveteamlotus.com/

There's a shedload of comments on this blog already, but the most interesting (to members of this forum anyway) is the one from Phillippe Adams, voicing his support for Tony Fernandes' squad.

Wonder if any other ex-Lotus drivers will chip in?
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Glennerz »

Phoenix wrote:I'm seeing Vitaly Petrov's seat in danger too, which would be a shame.


If Group Lotus plan to influence the 2011 driver line-up at all, they would do well to consider Petrov's commercial benefits - as seen last year, with the Lada, Flagman Vodka sponsorships etc. This Dany Bahar character seems very much motivated by money, and I imagine he would welcome further potential Russian investment.

Furthermore, Gerard Lopez and Genii Capital are still the team's majority shareholders, and Petrov impressed Lopez at Abu Dhabi so I would hope he and Eric Bouiller do not allow Lotus' involvement to interfere with important decisions like driver line-up, at least not so early into Lotus' commitment.

I also think Marussia Virgin Racing would like a Russian driver, and believe they are bidding for Petrov, with their second choice (if Lotus Renault choose to retain Vitaly) Mikhail Aleshin, who impressed them during the Young Driver Test last month. So I think Petrov will remain in F1 for 2011, whether with Lotus Renault or with another team remains to be seen.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by JohnMLTX »

dinizintheoven wrote:(Long-term F1 watcher, medium-term observer of F1 Rejects, first time poster, and yes, I'll do the intro thing later because it's 1:30 in the morning and I should not be up wasting time on the internet, but for now...)

http://www.saveteamlotus.com/

There's a shedload of comments on this blog already, but the most interesting (to members of this forum anyway) is the one from Phillippe Adams, voicing his support for Tony Fernandes' squad.

Wonder if any other ex-Lotus drivers will chip in?


That made me laugh. Also, it'd be nice to have good ol' Zanardi come out and say, 'i raced under David Hunt's ownership in Japan and Australia in 1994', essentially shafting group lotus.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Cynon »

Something just occurred to me; Renault's still under that two-year suspended ban, right?
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Jeroen Krautmeir »

BlindCaveSalamander wrote:Go home, Proton. You're not a bunch of plucky, hard-trying guys trying to revive a famous name, you're just a bunch of greedy faceless suits looking to get rich off of said famous name. You also ruined the best livery in Formula 1. Go home, Proton.

And I think the livery is alright, but knowing what it has replaced and what it stands for makes me very, very angry.

Agreed, except for the livery, it looks horrendous.
Last edited by Jeroen Krautmeir on 09 Dec 2010, 06:16, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Chewie »

This is a much nicer version of the black and gold:-

http://www.electroduo.com/LotusT128EF/
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by JohnMLTX »

Chewie wrote:This is a much nicer version of the black and gold:-

http://www.electroduo.com/LotusT128EF/


That is sexytastic. Do want.

Oh, and 1Malaysia 2Malaysia 3Malaysia four.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Waris »

I don't like that they put the Union Jack flag on there, especially since it's still considered a French team! I can't stand that livery anyway, what with the hideous red wing end plates and mirrors. I much prefer the other livery someone posted above, I really hope Lotus go for that, or stick with the green and yellow... Speaking of yellow, there need to be yellow cars! I hope Hispania will change their livery to something with yellow and red, like in the Spanish flag.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Jeroen Krautmeir »

Chewie wrote:This is a much nicer version of the black and gold:-

http://www.electroduo.com/LotusT128EF/

Damn! That looks awesome!

A shame that nobody adapted it to the Lotus template for the livery competition. :(
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Waris »

They also made this one, I see:
http://www.electroduo.com/LotusT128AS/

I wonder what the third one is?
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by dr-baker »

Chewie wrote:This is a much nicer version of the black and gold:-

http://www.electroduo.com/LotusT128EF/

Waris wrote:They also made this one, I see:
http://www.electroduo.com/LotusT128AS/

I wonder what the third one is?


These two definately beat the Team Enstone livery! And is that what ex-Toleman/Benetton's nom de plume on this forum now - Team Enstone or some variant thereof?
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by noisebox »

mario wrote:By the way, I hope that you don't object to this critique - I respect the fact that you're taking a different stance, and that you are willing to support it, even if others might not.

Not at all - I can see both sides of this. I too am sceptical about the expansion plans for Group Lotus, and I accept your point about the ethos of Team Lotus. I standby the point that Fernandes was little more than opportunistic when he used the Lotus branding. 1Malaysia have a place in F1 as do Lotus. Personally I'd prefer to see the Lotus name associated with a car manufacturer, like it was in the old days.

EDIT: This post from the save Team Lotus website puts it better than I could ever hope to:

"Group Lotus have every right to be in F1. If you buy into a team, you have the right to be in F1. Ask Mercedes - they arrived with nothing, bought Brawn and carried on. Ask Red Bull - they bought Jaguar. Ask Toro Rosso - they bought Minardi. If GL buy into Renault, they're in F1. They have every right to call that team Lotus if they wish, since they own the name. What confuses me is why Fernandes, who has built his team from scratch, decided to buy a name he had no connection to, and stick that badge on his car? This talk of Lotus DNA and such is just crap. Team Lotus was dead and buried. Group Lotus claiming rights to the name in F1 is no different to Fernandes doing the same - neither have any connection to Team Lotus. Buying the name off David Hunt, who never did anything with it at all - it means nothing. You can't buy a history."
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Myrvold »

If Fernandes get the Lotus name with Team Lotus, it is just as much connect to Lotus Cars as Chapmans was.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Peter »

Quote from a familiar user, in unfamiliar territory...

Captain Hammer on GTPlanet wrote:They're not that bright. Dany Bahar has said he has "no issue" with there being two teams known as Lotus, but you can bet the FIA and/or Bernie will have something to say about it. I'm pretty sure there is a rule that dictates the changes a team can make to its name: 1) the new name must be an actual word (Hispania are known as HRT because the FIA did not recognise 'Hispania' as a word), 2) the name cannot reflect negatively on another team (so I can't start a team and call it Red Bull Are Cheaters), and 3) a team cannot have a name that is similar to that of an existing team, which is for the purposes of identification on timing sheets and among fans. Now, "Red Bull" and "Toro Rosso" might mean the same thing, but they sound totally different. And they're also owned by the same company. In this case, however, we have two teams known as "Lotus-Renault" who are engaged in a custody dispute over the name and are intending to run similar liveries in 2011. There's no way the FIA is going to allow this.

This isn't over. Not yet.
Last edited by Peter on 09 Dec 2010, 20:23, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by eagleash »

I believe Group/Proton have lost a previous legal case to the right to the Team Lotus name. Fernandes saw the opportunity to bring back a classic name when he took over the Litespeed entry & good luck to him it was a good PR/business decision. Group don't seem to have an issue with Lotus Shoes or Software or any of the other Cos. named Lotus. They are acting with a degree of spite because Tony F. beat them to it. He got there first, used the Lotus name as he had a right to do at the time, as there was no other Lotus involved, & then set about "legitimising" his team.
Group may feel they have a right to use the name as they do indeed own a version of it but it has always been (since the 1950s) separate to the racing side. But they should not be able to as things stand. Bernie & the FIA need to step in soon before too much more harm is done to all concerned.
Bahar has stated that he wants Lotus Cars to rival Ferrari. Can only see that ending badly & Proton being in more difficulty than they are already.
Any sympathy for Group's position must surely be dissipated by their almost childish behaviour.
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Phoenix
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Phoenix »

Peter wrote:Quote from a familiar user, in unfamiliar territory...

Captain Hammer on GTPlanet wrote:They're not that bright. Dany Bahar has said he has "no issue" with there being two teams known as Lotus, but you can bet the FIA and/or Bernie will have something to say about it. I'm pretty sure there is a rule that dictates the changes a team can make to its name: 1) the new name must be an actual word (Hispania are known as HRT because the FIA did not recognise 'Hispania' as a word), 2) the name cannot reflect negatively on another team (so I can't start a team and call it Red Bull Are Cheaters), and 3) a team cannot have a name that is similar to that of an existing team, which is for the purposes of identification on timing sheets and among fans. Now, "Red Bull" and "Toro Rosso" might mean the same thing, but they sound totally different. And they're also owned by the same company. In this case, however, we have two teams known as "Lotus-Renault" who are engaged in a custody dispute over the name and are intending to run similar liveries in 2011. There's no way the FIA is going to allow this.

This isn't over. Not yet.

Very true, really. Only one of them will win this (because, chances are there'll be a Lotus-Renault on the grid next year). Let's hope it's Fernandes and not Bahar.
noisebox wrote:
EDIT: This post from the save Team Lotus website puts it better than I could ever hope to:

"Group Lotus have every right to be in F1. If you buy into a team, you have the right to be in F1. Ask Mercedes - they arrived with nothing, bought Brawn and carried on. Ask Red Bull - they bought Jaguar. Ask Toro Rosso - they bought Minardi. If GL buy into Renault, they're in F1. They have every right to call that team Lotus if they wish, since they own the name. What confuses me is why Fernandes, who has built his team from scratch, decided to buy a name he had no connection to, and stick that badge on his car? This talk of Lotus DNA and such is just crap. Team Lotus was dead and buried. Group Lotus claiming rights to the name in F1 is no different to Fernandes doing the same - neither have any connection to Team Lotus. Buying the name off David Hunt, who never did anything with it at all - it means nothing. You can't buy a history."

OK, fair enough, but what's the problem with having Team Lotus again, even if they bought the rights from David Hunt, who effectively did nothing with them in 15 years? Plus, it's abundantly clear that Proton's plans are completely out of kilt, so if someone will enter a Lotus F1Team, it better be Tony Fernandes, who has a more balanced approach and is, after all, the owner of the Lotus F1 rights (Team Lotus), which is a fact. Agreed that they didn't have anything to do with Team Lotus superb F1 achievements, but heck...
And those liveries posted were simply awesome. The best I've seen in this regard since a certain 1986 machine...
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Captain Hammer »

dr-baker wrote:
Chewie wrote:This is a much nicer version of the black and gold:-

http://www.electroduo.com/LotusT128EF/

Waris wrote:They also made this one, I see:
http://www.electroduo.com/LotusT128AS/

I wonder what the third one is?


These two definately beat the Team Enstone livery! And is that what ex-Toleman/Benetton's nom de plume on this forum now - Team Enstone or some variant thereof?

But neither was submitted for the livery design contest, which ended last Sunday.

Anyway:

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

And a photoshop with black endplates:

Image
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by JohnMLTX »

Captain Hammer wrote:And a photoshop with black endplates:

Image


That looks far superior. It's amazing how something small and red could ruin a livery.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Myrvold »

I still wish Petrov can carry some Lada sponsorship, just think of the situation... a Lada, Renault and Lotus marked car!
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Shizuka »

Image

This is a clusterbathplug.

Code: Select all

14:03   RaikkonenPlsCare   There's some water in water
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by Waris »

I don't like the livery at all, it's waaay too loud and obnoxious. It looks heaps better without the red, but still, one can't help but feel as though they should've made the stripes a bit smaller, and put less sponsor logos (okay, no way that would ever happen) on the car.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by mario »

Myrvold wrote:I still wish Petrov can carry some Lada sponsorship, just think of the situation... a Lada, Renault and Lotus marked car!

I thought that the deal with Lada was through Renault, not Petrov - at the time, Renault had become a major shareholder in Lada, and were hoping to crack the Russian car market, whilst improving the image of Lada.
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Re: Renault to become Group Lotus-Renault

Post by dr-baker »

eagleash wrote:I believe Group/Proton have lost a previous legal case to the right to the Team Lotus name. Fernandes saw the opportunity to bring back a classic name when he took over the Litespeed entry & good luck to him it was a good PR/business decision. Group don't seem to have an issue with Lotus Shoes or Software or any of the other Cos. named Lotus. They are acting with a degree of spite because Tony F. beat them to it. He got there first, used the Lotus name as he had a right to do at the time, as there was no other Lotus involved, & then set about "legitimising" his team.
Group may feel they have a right to use the name as they do indeed own a version of it but it has always been (since the 1950s) separate to the racing side. But they should not be able to as things stand. Bernie & the FIA need to step in soon before too much more harm is done to all concerned.
Bahar has stated that he wants Lotus Cars to rival Ferrari. Can only see that ending badly & Proton being in more difficulty than they are already.
Any sympathy for Group's position must surely be dissipated by their almost childish behaviour.

When I read this, it made me think of the Apple v. Apple case where the Beatles' Apple Corps sued Apple computers for infringing into their musical marketplace...
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