Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

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Pick your Reject of the Race candidate!

Poll ended at 02 Jun 2023, 11:30

Carlos Sainz Jr.
0
No votes
George Russell
1
4%
Kevin Magnussen
0
No votes
Lance Stroll
6
23%
Nico Hulkenberg
0
No votes
Sergio Perez
13
50%
All of the Above
6
23%
 
Total votes: 26

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Londoner
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Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Londoner »

1. Sergio Perez. Well, it was nice to have the illusion of a title battle this season.

2. Lance Stroll. Frankly a bit amateurish round the streets.

Honourable mention to Haas, it seems they gave up on the race the moment it started raining.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by RAK »

1) Lance Stroll: Playing pinball with the Monaco barriers. Embarrassing.

2) Sergio Perez: Completely off form while his teammate imperiously took another win.

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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Enforcer »

Sainz, Perez and (S)Troll all had amateur moments, with poor pace thrown in for the latter two, but George Russell's rejoin into Perez was cringier imo, so I'll go with him.
Last edited by Enforcer on 28 May 2023, 15:01, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Hermann95 »

1) Lance, that was shameful all rave long

2) Perez, lot's of mistakes (especially in Q1)

HM: Haas
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by FalconCapelli »

Sergio Pearez: I think this race is his worst race yet
Ferrari Strategy Team: they didnt surprise me in the slightest lol :pantano:
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Shadaza »

Sergio Perez. Crashing out of qualifying at the most important qualifying session of the year in the best car is a horrible start. Then he was involved in many a crash and accident. Tried to argue an illegal pass on Stroll and his only use in the race was to mule full wet tires.

Lance Stroll Probably hit every wall on the circuit. Slow, dumb overtaking attempts. Far off Alonso, again.

HM: Haas were woeful in terms of pace, strategy and driver errors. But they kind of didn't have much else to go on anyway.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by IceG »

(1) Stroll - all over the place

(2) Haas - very poor all round

HM Perez for being a guinea pig after binning it in qualy
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Cynon »

Sergio Perez -- Thanks for giving the whole rest of the grid some damn good looks at the floor of the Red Bull!

Lance Stroll -- I can't tell if I want him out of F1 because he's a nepotism baby or if his ineptitude keeps F1 interesting.

Honorable Mentions:
Haas -- Managing to be shite, but not in any way that's interesting.
Logan Sargeant -- Now this guy I actively want out of F1 as soon as possible, and the more Latifiesque showings like this he has, the quicker that will happen.
Carlos Sainz -- What was that?
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Rob Dylan »

Surely it has to be "the same bunch of no-hopers crashing every five to ten laps". Kevin Magnussen, Lance Stroll, Carlos Sainz Jr., and Sergio Perez between them were responsible for about 95% of the drama, silliness, and incidents. It's hard to wrap my head around just how many escape-road offs, crashes, bumps, chicane-cutting things we saw just from those four.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by mario »

Londoner wrote: 28 May 2023, 14:54 1. Sergio Perez. Well, it was nice to have the illusion of a title battle this season.

2. Lance Stroll. Frankly a bit amateurish round the streets.

Honourable mention to Haas, it seems they gave up on the race the moment it started raining.
Both pretty solid nominations - it all went to pieces for Perez, and Stroll didn't exactly cover himself in glory either. You also have to wonder why Haas left their drivers out for so long on slicks when it became clear that intermediates were the way to go.

Sargeant also had a fairly troubled race too - it says a lot that Haas could get it disastrously wrong with changing to intermediates and still managed to beat him.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Meatwad »

Sergio Pérez: To think we were talking about his chances to fight for the championship just a while ago. Just an embarrassment – crashed out in Q1, couldn't overtake Stroll, then passed him illegally (while blaming Stroll for pushing him off), crashed into Magnussen... The only positive thing about his race was the gamble to take wets (because why not), but even that didn't work out. Red Bull definitely didn't expect this kind of performance when they picked Pérez after Gasly and Albon's struggles.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Batty »

The choices are a lot

However

1. Haas - Just for sheer hilarity. Hulk smashes into Logan and gets a pen. Fails to serve pen and gets another pen and gets stuck in full wets. Magnussen plonks around on hard tires in the wet while everyone else is on inters for a solid 3 laps or so and then he hits the wall and then goes off on the wets

2. Checo - Crashes in quali, hits Magnussen and gets lapped twice by his teammate. Not the ideal championship contention. Also hit the barrier. And when he did hit K-Mag, he was supposed to give the spot back to Stroll after illegally passing him. Stroll only got the place back cause Checo hit Magnussen

S/O
Stroll - Baaad race
Russell - Reversing into Checo
Ferrari - Strategy was whacked and allowed Mercs to jump them both

I'm giving Logan a pass cause Hulk might have damaged his car.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Ciaran »

  1. Ferrari for being Ferrari.
  2. Checo for hammering in the final nail of the coffin in the 2023 title fight. GG Max.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by James1978 »

It's a toss-up between:

Checo - the most costly in that it waves goodbye to any hopes we had of a championship battle. Effectively became a guinea pig for Max in the changing conditions.

Stroll - if the team have got serious top-contending aspirations then the owner's son is becoming a liability. Alonso can't keep them 2nd in the constructors on his own when both Merc drivers are consistently scoring like they are, and even the Ferrari are closer together even if they do make niggly errors. It's reminding me of how Hill could have cost Jordan 3rd in 1999 but lucky for him their nearest rivals Williams had Zanardi in the second car and he struggled even more.

DHMs to Haas and Ferrari.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by rachel1990 »

1- Lance Stroll- played Pinball with the barriers and the car finally broke- usually quite good in wet weather.

2- Sergio Perez- 12 months is a long time in f1- lots of mistakes and finished right down the order- what was that about a championship challenge Sergio...

Hm- Haas for allowing k-mag on Hards far too long and Ferrari for well being Ferrari
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Spectoremg »

1. Perez. Had his Monza head on at the wrong circuit. HM to anyone who thought he was a serious championship contender.
2. Sainz. Monaco sorts the men from the boys. My jury's been out with him for some time but the verdict now is not good enough. Ferrari, you need another star.
HM: Alonso changing to slicks when wets was the obvious choice.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Alextrax52 »

Perez: Congratulations to Max Verstappen on winning the 2023 drivers championship. Not for the first time have we seen a frontrunner’s Monaco weekend effectively over because they crashed in practice or qualy.

Stroll: At what point do we start asking questions?. 27 points and not a single podium in what’s arguably been the 2nd quickest car up to now just isn’t good enough. A nice lad but if Aston Martin are going to fulfill their ambitions of fighting for the championship then the owner needs to show his ruthlessness and sack his son.

DHM’s

Haas: Hey let’s leave K-Mag out on dries for a full 3 laps after everyone else has pitted for inters, can’t see any problems here. Bonus points for Hulk’s miserable afternoon

Ferrari for being their usual selves. Hamilton may be on a lean streak with Mercedes right now but he’d be nuts to consider touching Ferrari with a barge pole
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Forti »

Sergio Perez - The world champion, they said.
Haas - Hilariously poor strategy and wouldn't stop binning it
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Wallio »

Haas - Every week they just get worse and worse. Gene is content to spend under the cap and make a profit each year (like so many American sports team owners). Shame, as I would love to see what the team could do if it was allowed to try.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Rob Dylan »

There were so many different candidates for various incidents, most of them for the same overall reason, that I have given you the option to vote for either one or all of them. You have 48 hours to get your vote in :dance:
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by James1978 »

I didn't vote for him, but seeing Russell as an option made me remember something which I thought was quite hilarious - him being repeatedly on the blower to the team to get him let past Lewis to try and protect him from his penalty, only to finish 12 seconds behind him at the end - has shades of Ocon being obsessed with beating Alonso at what cost last year!
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Row Man Gross-Gene »

James1978 wrote: 31 May 2023, 18:31 I didn't vote for him, but seeing Russell as an option made me remember something which I thought was quite hilarious - him being repeatedly on the blower to the team to get him let past Lewis to try and protect him from his penalty, only to finish 12 seconds behind him at the end - has shades of Ocon being obsessed with beating Alonso at what cost last year!
I'm curious about the Some of the Russell dislike I see. You're only sort of hinting at it here... but is it just the incongruity of some of his actions with his image? Overall, he doesn't seem that much more egregious that others whom I do have a more favorable opinion of. (I know I've asked about this before) I just wonder what it is?
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by James1978 »

I think my avatar doesn't say that in general - I just thought it was funny given the distance he'd dropped back by the end :-)
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Row Man Gross-Gene »

James1978 wrote: 31 May 2023, 18:55 I think my avatar doesn't say that in general - I just thought it was funny given the distance he'd dropped back by the end :-)
I should say that I didn't think you were being too hard on him or anything, it's a little different in this case, but some on this board, and some podcasters, among others, have kind of noted some of Russell's reactions, reasonings, behaviors etc. My thought is these can seem a little Machiavellian, but Russell has finally begun taking a little stick for it after seeming above it for a couple/few years. The thing is, when some of the other drivers do the same thing, it's almost thought of as cute or quaint at this point. Leclerc seems to get away with similar. I speculate he does because he also appears able to take the blame for incidents (when he's at fault) a bit more readily than Russell does. But I don't know, I may just be missing something.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Wallio »

Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: 31 May 2023, 19:43
James1978 wrote: 31 May 2023, 18:55 I think my avatar doesn't say that in general - I just thought it was funny given the distance he'd dropped back by the end :-)
I should say that I didn't think you were being too hard on him or anything, it's a little different in this case, but some on this board, and some podcasters, among others, have kind of noted some of Russell's reactions, reasonings, behaviors etc. My thought is these can seem a little Machiavellian, but Russell has finally begun taking a little stick for it after seeming above it for a couple/few years. The thing is, when some of the other drivers do the same thing, it's almost thought of as cute or quaint at this point. Leclerc seems to get away with similar. I speculate he does because he also appears able to take the blame for incidents (when he's at fault) a bit more readily than Russell does. But I don't know, I may just be missing something.

I think I've mentioned it before, but a lot of it for me is just extreme hype backlash. For years he was proclaimed the second coming at Williams when in reality he was little more than a Jarno Trulli, great qualifier, pretty mediocre on Sunday. Each week we would have to hear about the Great British Hope (TM) while he finished behind Kubica in WDC in 2019 (with Robert getting second-tier stuff). He likewise was being hyped for a Mercedes drive in 2020 despite spending the entire year behind Latifi in the championship until he got into a Merc at Sakir. All the while doing dumb stuff like wiping out Bottas at Imola, and continuing to blame him even when Toto told him to shut up.

So yeah, I do take some sick happiness in him failing/goofing up but I've had four years of "OmG gEoRgE iS lItErAlLy FaNgIo!" to balance it out.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Row Man Gross-Gene »

Wallio wrote: 31 May 2023, 20:10
Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: 31 May 2023, 19:43
James1978 wrote: 31 May 2023, 18:55 I think my avatar doesn't say that in general - I just thought it was funny given the distance he'd dropped back by the end :-)
I should say that I didn't think you were being too hard on him or anything, it's a little different in this case, but some on this board, and some podcasters, among others, have kind of noted some of Russell's reactions, reasonings, behaviors etc. My thought is these can seem a little Machiavellian, but Russell has finally begun taking a little stick for it after seeming above it for a couple/few years. The thing is, when some of the other drivers do the same thing, it's almost thought of as cute or quaint at this point. Leclerc seems to get away with similar. I speculate he does because he also appears able to take the blame for incidents (when he's at fault) a bit more readily than Russell does. But I don't know, I may just be missing something.

I think I've mentioned it before, but a lot of it for me is just extreme hype backlash. For years he was proclaimed the second coming at Williams when in reality he was little more than a Jarno Trulli, great qualifier, pretty mediocre on Sunday. Each week we would have to hear about the Great British Hope (TM) while he finished behind Kubica in WDC in 2019 (with Robert getting second-tier stuff). He likewise was being hyped for a Mercedes drive in 2020 despite spending the entire year behind Latifi in the championship until he got into a Merc at Sakir. All the while doing dumb stuff like wiping out Bottas at Imola, and continuing to blame him even when Toto told him to shut up.

So yeah, I do take some sick happiness in him failing/goofing up but I've had four years of "OmG gEoRgE iS lItErAlLy FaNgIo!" to balance it out.
You are definitely one of them I was thinking of and it's interesting to get the reasoning. I remember he (Russell) once was upset at my man Grosjean and so many people have been pissed at him and it was funny that all it took was Grosjean cooking a meal with him or something to smooth it all over. (There is just something about a French driver using his cooking skills that tickles my funny bone.) Anyhow, the extra charm that a Grosjean or a Leclerc possess that helps extricate them from this junk is interesting because it seems to me that Russell just doesn't have it. And I wonder how much that hurts him. It seems that for you, Wallio, the charmlessness does hurt him. I guess it does for me too. It may be unfair, but there it is.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Wallio »

Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: 31 May 2023, 20:32
You are definitely one of them I was thinking of and it's interesting to get the reasoning. I remember he (Russell) once was upset at my man Grosjean and so many people have been pissed at him and it was funny that all it took was Grosjean cooking a meal with him or something to smooth it all over. (There is just something about a French driver using his cooking skills that tickles my funny bone.) Anyhow, the extra charm that a Grosjean or a Leclerc possess that helps extricate them from this junk is interesting because it seems to me that Russell just doesn't have it. And I wonder how much that hurts him. It seems that for you, Wallio, the charmlessness does hurt him. I guess it does for me too. It may be unfair, but there it is.

I freely admit I hold onto werid reasons for not liking people. Sainz for example I actually root against because of his TV camera finding attention hog brother/agent. Dude ruins EVERYTHING. While am I softening on Hamilton (mostly because compared to George he's a saint) his skipping the Hall of Fame for a fashion show turned me right off for years. I never could stand Sato in F1 due to Super Aguri, although I do root for him now in Indy.

Conversely (and crossing over into our other thread) while I think Stroll is lackluster, I don't actually hate him. Probably because when I raced I too drove for my father. So yeah I'm werid, and probably a hypocrite lol.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Rob Dylan »

Russell is a young playboy who is absolutely in the "in crowd". As was just said, he was hyped to heaven for his prowess, and sadly he himself has bought into that hype - a major mistake for anyone. He plays to the media because he knows he will always be "their man". So when he takes out Sainz at COTA or one of the many other first-lap incidents, or reverses into the middle of the track during the middle of a rainy Monaco, it's a little hard to be sympathetic.

Plus, this site being pretty heavily populated by contrarians, those who like backmarkers and dislike the F1 media and feel free to point out the publicocraph when we see it, it's pretty common for us to have consensus opinions that are jarring perhaps compared to the norm: the hype behind Kobayashi and Hulkenberg, the dislike of Räikkönen's return to Ferrari, defending Maldonado, lambasting Ricciardo at McLaren, to name just a few examples that come to my mind.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Enforcer »

Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: 31 May 2023, 18:50 I'm curious about the Some of the Russell dislike I see. You're only sort of hinting at it here... but is it just the incongruity of some of his actions with his image? Overall, he doesn't seem that much more egregious that others whom I do have a more favorable opinion of. (I know I've asked about this before) I just wonder what it is?
He seems to get involved in more than his share of incidents and the British F1 media my coverage comes via never seem to mention it. I wonder what they'd say if Verstappen had annihilated Bottas at Imola a couple of years back or been involved in the crash that turned over Zhou?

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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by mario »

Rob Dylan wrote: 01 Jun 2023, 11:11 Russell is a young playboy who is absolutely in the "in crowd". As was just said, he was hyped to heaven for his prowess, and sadly he himself has bought into that hype - a major mistake for anyone. He plays to the media because he knows he will always be "their man". So when he takes out Sainz at COTA or one of the many other first-lap incidents, or reverses into the middle of the track during the middle of a rainy Monaco, it's a little hard to be sympathetic.

Plus, this site being pretty heavily populated by contrarians, those who like backmarkers and dislike the F1 media and feel free to point out the publicocraph when we see it, it's pretty common for us to have consensus opinions that are jarring perhaps compared to the norm: the hype behind Kobayashi and Hulkenberg, the dislike of Räikkönen's return to Ferrari, defending Maldonado, lambasting Ricciardo at McLaren, to name just a few examples that come to my mind.
That said, there may also be some element of reporting bias too - by their nature, the press are more likely to report on those occasions where Russell is perceived as playing to their interests, resulting in that becoming the dominant impression that they then repeat back.

I do also wonder if some of the hype that you comment on about him being at Williams was in part because there was also a lot of hype surrounding Kubica's return to F1 - in effect, building hype around Kubica meant that Russell, as Kubica's team mate, would be drawn into a similar hype cycle as well.
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Re: Reject of the Race - Monaco 2023

Post by Londoner »

Fetzie on Ferrari wrote:How does a driver hurtling around a race track while they're sous-viding in their overalls have a better understanding of the race than a team of strategy engineers in an air-conditioned room?l
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