Unusual F1 Stats

Post by **tommykl** » 28 Jan 2016, 23:58

I worked this out a couple of months ago, but I'm only getting around to posting it, because reasons. Anyways.

Drivers who were youngest on the grid most often
1. Rubens Barrichello - 53 (South Africa 1993 - Japan 1996)
2. Jaime Alguersuari - 46 (Hungary 2009 - Brazil 2011)
3. Fernando Alonso - 38 (Australia 2001 - Europe 2005)
4. Andrea de Cesaris - 37 (USA East 1980 - Europe 1983)
5. Christian Klien - 31 (Australia 2004 - China 2005)
6. Hans Joachim Stuck - 28 (Argentina 1974 - USA West 1977)
7. Chris Amon - 27 (Belgium 1963 - USA 1968)
=. Elio de Angelis - 27 (Argentina 1979 - Netherlands 1981)
=. Nico Rosberg - 27 (Bahrain 2006 - Europe 2007)
10. Sebastian Vettel - 26 (USA 2007 - Brazil 2008)
11. Jacky Ickx - 24 (Italy 1967 - Netherlands 1971)
12. Niki Lauda - 21 (Austria 1971 - Italy 1973)
13. Jean-Eric Vergne - 20 (Australia 2012 - Brazil 2012)
14. Alex Caffi - 19 (Italy 1986 - Portugal 1989)
=. Esteban Gutiérrez - 19 (Australia 2013 - Brazil 2013)
=. Daniil Kvyat - 19 (Australia 2014 - Abu Dhabi 2014)
=. Max Verstappen - 19 (Australia 2015 - Abu Dhabi 2015)
18. Ayrton Senna - 18 (Brazil 1984 - Canada 1986)
=. Jenson Button - 18 (Australia 2000 - USA 2002)
20. Bruce McLaren - 17 (Monaco 1959 - Monaco 1963)
21. Peter Collins - 16 (Switzerland 1952 - Argentina 1958)
=. Esteban Tuero - 16 (Australia 1998 - Japan 1998)
=. Felipe Massa - 16 (Australia 2002 - Japan 2002)
24. Jochen Rindt - 14 (South Africa 1965 - Mexico 1966)
=. Emerson Fittipaldi - 14 (Britain 1970 - USA 1971)
=. Rupert Keegan - 14 (Spain 1977 - France 1978)
27. Jody Scheckter - 13 (USA 1972 - Monaco 1975)
=. Pierluigi Martini - 13 (Brazil 1985 - South Africa 1985)
29. Corrado Fabi - 12 (Brazil 1983 - Dallas 1984)
=. Michael Schumacher - 12 (Belgium 1991 - Italy 1992)
=. Ralf Schumacher - 12 (Australia 1997 - Spain 1999)
=. Ricardo Zonta - 12 (Australia 1999 - Japan 1999)
33. Tarso Marques - 11 (Brazil 1996 - Europe 1997)
34. Tony Brise - 10 (Spain 1975 - USA 1975)
=. Christian Fittipaldi - 10 (South Africa 1992 - Australia 1992)
36. Stirling Moss - 9 (Switzerland 1951 - Spain 1954)
=. Héctor Rebaque - 9 (Germany 1977 - USA East 1978)
=. Mika Häkkinen - 9 (USA 1991 - Hungary 1991)
=. Sébastien Buemi - 9 (Australia 2009 - Germany 2009)
40. Allen Berg - 8 (USA 1986 - Australia 1986)
=. Bernd Schneider - 8 (Mexico 1988 - Japan 1989)
=. Giancarlo Fisichella - 8 (Australia 1996 - Britain 1996)
43. Cesare Perdisa - 7 (Monaco 1955 - Argentina 1957)
=. Masten Gregory - 7 (Monaco 1957 - Morocco 1958)
=. George Eaton - 7 (USA 1969 - Canada 1970)
=. Nicola Larini (Spain 1987 - Canada 1989)
=. JJ Lehto - 7 (Spain 1989 - Germany 1990)
48. Riccardo Patrese - 6 (Japan 1977 - Monaco 1979)
=. Ivan Capelli - 6 (Europe 1985 - Canada 1988)
=. Eric Bernard - 6 (France 1989 - Spain 1990)
51. Tony Brooks - 5 (Britain 1957 - Portugal 1958)
=. Ricardo Rodriguez - 5 (Italy 1961 - Italy 1962)
=. Johnny Herbert - 5 (San Marino 1989 - Belgium 1989)
54. José Froilán González - 4 (Monaco 1950 - Spain 1951)
=. Gianni Morbidelli - 4 (Brazil 1990 - France 1991)
56. Mike Hawthorn - 3 (Switzerland 1953 - France 1954)
=. Fritz d'Orey - 3 (France 1959 - USA 1959)
=. Chris Bristow - 3 (Monaco 1960 - Belgium 1960)
=. Mike Hailwood - 3 (Italy 1963 - Italy 1964)
=. Ingo Hoffmann - 3 (Brazil 1976 - Brazil 1977)
=. Jean Alesi - 3 (Germany 1989 - Italy 1989)
=. David Brabham - 3 (France 1990 - Portugal 1990)
63. Geoff Crossley - 2 (Britain 1950 - Belgium 1950)
=. Jacques Swaters - 2 (Germany 1951 - Italy 1951)
=. Eugenio Castellotti - 2 (Argentina 1955 - Netherlands 1955)
=. Carel Godin de Beaufort - 2 (Netherlands 1958 - Netherlands 1959)
=. Keith Greene - 2 (Britain 1960 - Britain 1961)
68. Harry Schell - 1 (Switzerland 1950)
=. Alberto Ascari - 1 (Italy 1950)
=. André Pilette - 1 (Belgium 1951)
=. Onofre Marimón - 1 (France 1951)
=. Fritz Riess - 1 (Germany 1952)
=. John Barber - 1 (Argentina 1953)
=. Mike MacDowel - 1 (France 1957)
=. Alan Stacey - 1 (Britain 1958)
=. Fred Gamble - 1 (Italy 1960)
=. Peter Ryan - 1 (USA 1961)
=. Timmy Mayer - 1 (USA 1962)
=. Mike Harris - 1 (South Africa 1962)
=. Pedro Rodriguez - 1 (USA 1963)
=. Brausch Niemann - 1 (South Africa 1963)
=. Richard Attwood - 1 (Monaco 1965)
=. Chris Irwin - 1 (Britain 1966)
=. Piers Courage - 1 (South Africa 1967)
=. Jackie Oliver - 1 (Monaco 1968)
=. Rikky von Opel - 1 (Austria 1973)
=. Noritake Takahara - 1 (Japan 1976)
=. Eddie Cheever - 1 (South Africa 1978)
=. Mike Thackwell - 1 (Canada 1980)
=. Martin Brundle - 1 (San Marino 1984)
=. Gerhard Berger - 1 (Italy 1984)
=. Gregor Foitek - 1 (USA 1990)
=. Pedro Lamy - 1 (San Marino 1994)
=. Jan Magnussen - 1 (Pacific 1995)
=. Patrick Friesacher - 1 (USA 2005)

Drivers who were oldest on the grid most often
1. Michael Schumacher - 96 (Brazil 2004 - Brazil 2012)
2. Jacques Laffite - 63 (Belgium 1982 - Britain 1986)
3. Jack Brabham - 59 (Netherlands 1961 - Mexico 1970)
4. Graham Hill - 54 (France 1965 - Brazil 1975)
5. Vittorio Brambilla - 52 (Austria 1975 - Italy 1980)
6. Nelson Piquet - 39 (Brazil 1987 - Australia 1991)
7. Kimi Räikkönen - 38 (Australia 2014 - Abu Dhabi 2015)
8. René Arnoux - 37 (Belgium 1987 - Australia 1989)
9. Damon Hill - 35 (Canada 1997 - Japan 1999)
=. David Coulthard - 35 (Australia 2007 - Brazil 2008)
11. Jean Alesi - 34 (Australia 2000 - Japan 2001)
12. Olivier Panis - 33 (Australia 2003 - Japan 2004)
13. Maurice Trintignant - 32 (Monaco 1958 - Italy 1964)
14. Mario Andretti - 28 (Monaco 1978 - Las Vegas 1982)
15. Nigel Mansell - 22 (South Africa 1992 - Spain 1995)
16. Clay Regazzoni - 19 (Brazil 1978 - USA West 1980)
=. Mark Webber - 19 (Australia 2013 - Brazil 2013)
18. Eddie Irvine - 17 (Australia 2002 - Japan 2002)
19. Philippe Alliot - 16 (South Africa 1993 - Belgium 1994)
20. Rubens Barrichello - 15 (Australia 2009 - Abu Dhabi 2009)
21. Gerhard Berger - 14 (Australia 1997 - Europe 1997)
22. Louis Rosier - 13 (Argentina 1954 - Germany 1956)
=. Martin Brundle - 13 (Australia 1996 - Japan 1996)
24. Philippe Etancelin - 12 (Britain 1950 - France 1952)
25. Roberto Moreno - 11 (Brazil 1995 - Australia 1995)
26. Michele Alboreto - 10 (Brazil 1994 - Portugal 1994)
27. Juan Manuel Fangio - 9 (Argentina 1957 - France 1958)
28. Mark Donohue - 8 (Monaco 1975 - Germany 1975)
29. Jack Fairman - 7 (France 1958 - Italy 1961)
=. Alan Jones - 7 (Germany 1986 - Australia 1986)
=. Giovanni Lavaggi - 7 (Germany 1995 - Portugal 1996)
32. Felice Bonetto - 5 (Italy 1952 - Switzerland 1953)
=. Louis Chiron - 5 (Britain 1951 - Monaco 1955)
34. Sam Tingle - 4 (South Africa 1965 - South Africa 1969)
=. Piercarlo Ghinzani - 4 (San Marino 1987 - Spain 1989)
36. Giuseppe Farina - 3 (Netherlands 1952 - Argentina 1955)
=. Piero Taruffi - 3 (Britain 1955 - Italy 1956)
=. Ian Raby - 3 (Britain 1963 - Britain 1965)
=. John Love - 3 (South Africa 1970 - South Africa 1972)
40. Arthur Legat - 2 (Belgium 1952 - Belgium 1953)
=. Hans Stuck - 2 (Switzerland 1952 - Germany 1953)
=. Roy Salvadori - 2 (Netherlands 1962 - Britain 1962)
=. Doug Serrurier - 2 (South Africa 1962 - South Africa 1963)
=. Walt Hansgen - 2 (USA 1961 - USA 1964)
=. Al Pease - 2 (Canada 1967 - Canada 1969)
=. Pete Lovely - 2 (Canada 1971 - USA 1971)
=. Denny Hulme - 2 (Argentina 1973 - Brazil 1973)
=. Carlos Reutemann - 2 (South Africa 1982 - Brazil 1982)
=. John Watson - 2 (Italy 1983 - Europe 1983)
=. Riccardo Patrese - 2 (Japan 1993 - USA 1993)
=. Luca Badoer - 2 (Europe 2009 - Belgium 2009)
52. Eitel Cantoni - 1 (Britain 1952)
=. Adolf Brudes - 1 (Germany 1952)
=. Karl Kling - 1 (Switzerland 1954)
=. Chico Landi - 1 (Argentina 1956)
=. Carlos Menditéguy - 1 (Argentina 1960)
=. Chuck Daigh - 1 (Belgium 1960)
=. Olivier Gendebien - 1 (Portugal 1960)
=. Arthur Owen - 1 (Italy 1960)
=. Rodger Ward - 1 (USA 1963)
=. André Pilette - 1 (Belgium 1964)
=. Edgar Barth - 1 (Germany 1964)
=. Roberto Bussinello - 1 (Italy 1965)
=. George Follmer - 1 (South Africa 1973)
=. Dave Charlton - 1 (South Africa 1975)
=. Jean-Pierre Jarier - 1 (San Marino 1982)
=. Keke Rosberg - 1 (South Africa 1985)

Peter Collins was youngest man on the grid at various times for almost six years, while Graham Hill was the oldest man on the grid sporadically for over ten years. Four drivers have been both the youngest and the oldest driver on the grid: Rubens Barrichello, Michael Schumacher, Riccardo Patrese...and André Pilette, for all of one race as each.

novitopoli · Post by **novitopoli** » 29 Jan 2016, 12:18

=. Patrick Friesacher - 1 (USA 2005)

Wait: he was the youngest actual starter for that race, but "technically" not the youngest "on the grid"...

FullMetalJack · Post by **FullMetalJack** » 29 Jan 2016, 12:36

Olivier Panis retired after Japan 2004, so Michael Schumacher would have been the oldest driver in Brazil.

MorbidelliObese · Post by **MorbidelliObese** » 29 Jan 2016, 13:27

WeirdKerr wrote:Something occurred to me recently that Fernando Alonso had swapped sides of the garage when he returned to McLaren

2007 Alonso, Hamilton
2008-9 Kovalainen, Hamilton
2010 -12 Button, Hamilton
2013 Button, Perez
2014 Button, Magnussen
2015- Button, Alonso

I looked back to other drivers returning to teams and I cannot find another driver that I can safely say swapped sides of the garage as I'm not sure whether Berger did so returning to Benetton in 1996 as both drivers changed

Kimi did it with Ferrari:

2009: Raikkonen, Massa
2010-13: Alonso, Massa
2014: Alonso, Raikkonen

Post by **tommykl** » 29 Jan 2016, 15:29

novitopoli wrote:
=. Patrick Friesacher - 1 (USA 2005)

Wait: he was the youngest actual starter for that race, but "technically" not the youngest "on the grid"...

Now, y'see, do you count 'the grid' as being the grid before the warm-up lap or at the race start? Someone whose clutch fails at the start is listed as 'retired', not as 'DNS', so I counted the grid as being after the warm-up lap.

FullMetalJack wrote:Olivier Panis retired after Japan 2004, so Michael Schumacher would have been the oldest driver in Brazil.

That's true, I didn't notice that. It's fixed now!

yannicksamlad · Post by **yannicksamlad** » 29 Jan 2016, 15:45

Phenomenal work on the oldest/youngest thing. Nice to see how some of the oldest in the race were showing everyone the way despite their age ...
Which sort of brings up the 'Mozart syndrome' thing - that we tend to think if two sportspeople are at the same level, the younger one will improve further ( and reach a higher peak performance level) . We discount the possibility of late developers when we consider sportspeople who are improving and developing.

Bleu · Post by **Bleu** » 19 Feb 2016, 12:32

Unofficial listing of youngest drivers at their last Grand Prix. Drivers with F1 contracts for 2016 are not listed.

Esteban Tuero: 20 years, 6 months, 10 days, Japan 1998
Ricardo Rodriguez: 20 years, 7 months, 2 days, Italy 1962
Peter Ryan: 21 years, 3 months, 28 days, USA 1961
Jaime Alguersuari: 21 years, 8 months, 4 days, Brazil 2011
Fritz d'Orey: 21 years, 8 months, 17 days, USA 1959
Jimmy Stewart: 22 years, 4 months, 12 days, Britain 1953
Chris Bristow: 22 years, 6 months, 17 days, Belgium 1960
Norberto Fontana: 22 years, 9 months, 4 days, Europe 1997
Sebastien Buemi: 23 years, 0 months, 27 days, Brazil 2011
Corrado Fabi: 23 years, 2 months, 26 days, Dallas 1984
Gianmaria Bruni: 23 years, 4 months, 25 days, Brazil 2004
Bill Mackey: 23 years, 5 months, 15 days, Indianapolis 1951
John Barber: 23 years, 5 months, 20 days, Argentina 1953
Max Chilton: 23 years, 5 months, 21 days, Russia 2014
Tony Brise: 23 years, 6 months, 7 days, USA 1975

Rodriguez, Ryan, Bristow, Mackey and Brise are in the list because of their deaths.

Dj_bereta · Post by **Dj_bereta** » 22 Feb 2016, 03:59

If Alonso wins his third title, he is going to break the record of biggest gap between titles of the same driver ever. If I remember well, Niki Lauda hold this record.

Bleu · Post by **Bleu** » 22 Feb 2016, 19:18

Dj_bereta wrote:If Alonso wins his third title, he is going to break the record of biggest gap between titles of the same driver ever. If I remember well, Niki Lauda hold this record.

Lauda has a record of biggest gap between two titles (1977-84)
Schumacher has a record of biggest gap between first and last title (1994-2004)

Alonso would break both records if he wins another title.

good_Ralf · Post by **good_Ralf** » 21 Mar 2016, 22:17

If Mercedes get a 1-2 next race, they'll break the record of 5 races in a row, so by that logic, at least one driver will get screwed over in two weeks! It happened in Canada 2014 when Merc were set to break the record.

watka · Post by **watka** » 23 Mar 2016, 13:19

With Jolyon Palmer, Kevin Magnussen, Nico Rosberg and Max Verstappen all on the grid this year, this is the most sons of former F1 drivers that we've had participating at the same time (not to mention Carlos Sainz Jr as the son of a rally champ).

Other times where we have had 3 sons competing:

1993 - Damon Hill, Christian Fittipaldi & Michael Andretti
1994 - Damon Hill, Christian Fittipaldi & David Brabham
2007 - Nico Rosberg, Kazuki Nakajima & Markus Winkelhock
2008 & 2009 - Nico Rosberg, Kazuki Nakajima & Nelsinho Piquet
2015 - Nico Rosberg, Kevin Magnussen & Max Verstappen

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 06 Apr 2016, 23:52

Seeing how badly McLaren have been doing this year has made me forget how badly they did last year. I was thinking that having 1 point after 2 races must have McLaren in an even worse situation than last year, but no, by this time last year McLaren still had no points, and didn't get any until Button's 8th-place finish in Monaco Round 6.

So in comparison to last year, McLaren's season is off to a good start with a solid point!

DonTirri · Post by **DonTirri** » 11 Apr 2016, 18:30

You know, to shed some light why despite the fact that the last few years have been utterly dominated by Merc and before that Red Bull, it has been a pleasant change of pace looking at history.

Buttons WDC at 2009 was the first time since 1983 that the title was taken by someone outside of the "Big Four" (McLaren, Williams, Ferrari, Benetton/Renault (aka team Enstone)).
During those 26 years it was Enstone 4 titles (Schuey x2 and Alonso x2) Ferrari 6 titles (Schuey x5 Räikkönen x1)
McLaren 11 titles (Lauda x1 Prost x3 Senna x3 Häkkinen x2 Hamilton x1) and Williams 5 titles (Piquet x1 Mansell x1 Prost x1 Hill x1 Villeneuve x1). also, if you discount Piquets two titles with Brabham, you can add 2 more titles to Williams (Jones 80 Rosberg 82) and one more to Ferrari (Schekter 79)

The sheer dominance of those 4 outfits stretches even further than that. between Detroit 87 (won by Senna in the Lotus) and 1996 Monaco Grand Prix (Won by Panis in the Ligier) EVERY single race was won by one of the Big Four.

infact if you discount Senna's heroics with Lotus (as the car was frankly not winning-material in 86 or 87 had it been driven by someone else) no driver driving for a team outside the Big Four managed more than one win in a season between 1984 (Piquet won twice in the Brabham) and 1999 (With Frenzen's two wins in the Jordan) and even after 99 it took TEN YEARS for someone outside the Big Four to score more than one win in a season.

So. All in all, the rise of Mercedes and Red Bull is a welcome thing to a sport that has been stagnant with the same 4 teams dominating the sport for almost 30 years.

WeirdKerr · Post by **WeirdKerr** » 11 Apr 2016, 21:33

DonTirri wrote:You know, to shed some light why despite the fact that the last few years have been utterly dominated by Merc and before that Red Bull, it has been a pleasant change of pace looking at history.

Buttons WDC at 2009 was the first time since 1983 that the title was taken by someone outside of the "Big Four" (McLaren, Williams, Ferrari, Benetton/Renault (aka team Enstone)).
During those 26 years it was Enstone 4 titles (Schuey x2 and Alonso x2) Ferrari 6 titles (Schuey x5 Räikkönen x1)
McLaren 11 titles (Lauda x1 Prost x3 Senna x3 Häkkinen x2 Hamilton x1) and Williams 5 titles (Piquet x1 Mansell x1 Prost x1 Hill x1 Villeneuve x1). also, if you discount Piquets two titles with Brabham, you can add 2 more titles to Williams (Jones 80 Rosberg 82) and one more to Ferrari (Schekter 79)

The sheer dominance of those 4 outfits stretches even further than that. between Detroit 87 (won by Senna in the Lotus) and 1996 Monaco Grand Prix (Won by Panis in the Ligier) EVERY single race was won by one of the Big Four.

infact if you discount Senna's heroics with Lotus (as the car was frankly not winning-material in 86 or 87 had it been driven by someone else) no driver driving for a team outside the Big Four managed more than one win in a season between 1984 (Piquet won twice in the Brabham) and 1999 (With Frenzen's two wins in the Jordan) and even after 99 it took TEN YEARS for someone outside the Big Four to score more than one win in a season.

So. All in all, the rise of Mercedes and Red Bull is a welcome thing to a sport that has been stagnant with the same 4 teams dominating the sport for almost 30 years.

Wow, though it could be argued that Red Bull and Brawn / Mercedes(Team Brackley) are just taking the place of Williams and Team Enstone in the big 4(just as Team Enstone themselves emerged as Benetton and took Lotus's place in the Big 4 back in the late 80s Early 90s)

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 11 Apr 2016, 21:48

DonTirri wrote:Good, interesting stuff.

Welcome back!

DonTirri · Post by **DonTirri** » 11 Apr 2016, 22:55

dr-baker wrote:
DonTirri wrote:Good, interesting stuff.

Welcome back!

Thank you ^^
Also one last note: 2009-2015 has been the longest period since Fittipaldi in 74 that one of the big four hasn't taken the title. 13 years is the longest ever (Hill 61 for Ferrari . Fittipaldi 74 for McLaren). Admittably most of that 13 years was with just Ferrari in the sport which oughta give some idea of just how dominant the big four have been

DonTirri · Post by **DonTirri** » 13 Apr 2016, 16:41

Continuing on the theme of championship wins, each decade of F1's existence has provided atleast ONE new winning team. Unless you count Brawn as a continuation of the Tyrrell-legacy, but considering that unlike Team Enstone, Brawn had NOTHING in common with Ken Tyrrells outfit, I would call them a new winner.

50's: Everyone
60's: Lotus, BRM, Tyrrell, Brabham
70's: McLaren
80's: Williams
90's: Benetton
00's: Brawn
10's: Red Bull

Also, since Lauda in 84, every championship winner has had either the Driver, Team or Engine in common with the preceding or following champion to this day, with the exception of Räikkönen in 2007

After Piquets standalone Brabham-win, it was 3 McLaren-Tag titles (84-86) 5 Honda titles (87-91) 2 Williams-Renault titles (92-93) two Schumacher Benetton titles (94-95), 2 Williams-Renault titles (96-97) 2 Häkkinen McLaren-Mercedes titles (98-99) 5 Schumacher Ferrari titles (00-05) 2 Alonso Renault titles (05-06), the exception to the rule in Räikkönen Ferrari in 07, 2 Mercedes titles (08-09) 4 Red Bull titles (10-13) and 2 Hamilton Mercedes titles (14-15)

AustralianStig · Post by **AustralianStig** » 18 Apr 2016, 00:18

Daniel Ricciardo has now finished 4th in the first 3 races, which seems rather unusual, however Mark Webber managed to go one better and finished 4th in the first 4 races of 2012!

Webber also managed to go on to take...you guessed it! 4 podiums that season.

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 19 Apr 2016, 12:38

Webber only got 4 podiums that year!? That was his last good year, I remember him being up at the front regularly in the first half at least :O

RonDenisDeletraz · Post by **RonDenisDeletraz** » 19 Apr 2016, 15:12

Rob Dylan wrote:Webber only got 4 podiums that year!? That was his last good year, I remember him being up at the front regularly in the first half at least :O

If my memory is correct, Webber looked in championship contention until about midway through the season, but tailed off towards the end of the season. I will always think Alonso deserved the title though, the 2012 Ferrari was never better than the third best car in the field

Dj_bereta · Post by **Dj_bereta** » 02 May 2016, 23:47

It's the second time in-a-row Hulkenberg is out of the race in the first lap and in turn 2 in the Russian Grand Prix.

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 05 May 2016, 04:04

F1 StatsOff!® Non-scorers®
The first StatsOff!® seemed to be enjoyable enough, but I've identified a problem with the way I decided who qualified that basically necessitates an entirely new tournament: the drivers were good. So this is the same as the first one, except that none of the drivers scored a point. Drivers were seeded firstly by number of entries, and if that was a tie, whoever had their first entry first got the better seed. So here's part 1 of round 1.

Luca Badoer - George Eaton
I don't think Eaton's best result of 10th can stand up to the epic that is Badoer's career. Almost disqualifying himself from the tournament in his fourth Grand Prix and the Agony of Nürburg will be difficult to beat for anyone.

Ian Burgess - Nanni Galli
Burgess got a 6th once, but it was in 1959. Galli's best result is 9th, and there isn't anything to make up for it.

Roberto Guerrero - Esteban Tuero
They both got an 8th once. On pure count-back, Tuero is better, but Guerrero moves on for surviving after his initial season. Perhaps that's unfair considering their respective circumstances, but one season with Minardi has a "just there once" feel to it that Guerrero avoids.

Eric van de Poele - François Migault
van de Poele has a 9th, 17 DNQs, 7 DNPQs, and he's Eric van de Poele. Meanwhile, Migault has a 14th and only one DNQ. EvdP wins.

Max Chilton - Giorgio Pantano
Two drivers in backmarker teams unable to touch their teammates... there really isn't a good reason to choose one over the other, but at least Chilton's entire existence didn't amount to an RotY. Points to Pantano for his dramatic exit, but Chilton wins.

Anthony Davidson - Corrado Fabi
Fabi got 7th in his last race. I wasn't around for 1984 F1, but looking at this table, everyone around you crashing makes a result more impressive than everyone's car failing. Of course, Davidson could have had a similar and possibly better thing. But looking over their whole careers, what's better, doing nothing at Osella or Super Aguri? Neither one trashed their teammate and made other teams want them. It's really close, but I guess it's Fabi because that 7th is cool and that's what this is about.

Bernd Schneider - Luciano Burti
It's hard to argue with all those DNPQs, but I think Burti's 8ths do it. Neither one destroyed any teammates, and from any sane perspective, you have to give it to Burti if you're just talking about statistics. Despite his (relative to Schneider) mundanity, Burti moves on.

Johnny Claes - Taki Inoue
Unlike some of the drivers featured, there's a good reason neither of these two ever scored. Claes did better in terms of getting high positions, and Stats F1 doesn't say "Spin" or "Accident" four times in eighteen races, so I'll give it to him.

Jan Lammers - Pascal Fabre
They have very similar high positions, Lammers was around for longer, and Lammers has 18 DNQs compared to Fabre's 3. Lammers moves on.

Oscar Larrauri - Jérôme d'Ambrosio
Two drivers who spent a year at the back barely touching their teammates, then came back for a bit the next year but didn't do much. I guess d'Ambrosio gets it for spending most of his F1 career racing.

Huub Rothengatter - Emilio de Villota
Rothengatter has a few single-digit finishes and de Villota doesn't.

Harald Ertl - Beppe Gabbiani
Ertl wins, see above.

Charles Pic - Patrick Nève
What do we like better, a 7th or actually racing a full season? Nève's epic results were because of reliability, but at least they were something, and "something" is something Charles Pic can't lay claim to.

Adrián Campos - Will Stevens
Campos' car exploded so often that he loses to a 2010s driver on count-back. Neither of them were really impressive, so I guess Stevens wins, although it's more like Campos loses.

Raul Boesel - Hans Binder
Boesel wins on both high results and longevity.

Scott Speed - Guy Edwards
They both almost got points, but at least Speed drove in a whole season. Being a failed junior driver is sort of boring, but I guess Speed was better, not that it's at all possible to tell.

BabyG · Post by **BabyG** » 05 May 2016, 16:37

Is the Kyvat/Verstappen swap the first intra-season straight swap of drivers between teams since… well I'm not sure, maybe 1994? I thought maybe the Alesi/Frentzen swap of 2001 but Frentzen missed the German GP so I don't think that should count.

Thoughts on a postcard please.

Peteroli34 · Post by **Peteroli34** » 05 May 2016, 20:55

BabyG wrote:Is the Kyvat/Verstappen swap the first intra-season straight swap of drivers between teams since… well I'm not sure, maybe 1994? I thought maybe the Alesi/Frentzen swap of 2001 but Frentzen missed the German GP so I don't think that should count.

Thoughts on a postcard please.

In 2001 Prost dropped Gaston Mazzacane and Jaguar dropped Luciano Burti. Burti went to Prost while Prost's test driver Pedro De La Rosa went to Jaguar

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 06 May 2016, 06:14

Yannick Dalmas - Roberto Merhi
At least Merhi has more career finishes. Just kidding.

Sakon Yamamoto - Ian Scheckter
There isn't anything special about Scheckter, which beats what is special about Yamamoto.

Mike Beuttler - Lance Macklin
Beuttler has the better finishes—couple more top tens, better single result—and Macklin doesn't have anything to make up for it.

Andrea Montermini - Allan McNish
Believe me, I tried to give this to Montermini, but I couldn't find anything that made him deserve it. McNish has better numbers, and it's with some disappointment that I say he's the one who moves on.

Rupert Keegan - Dave Charlton
Charlton did compete outside of South Africa, but he certainly still has that local South African driver feel. It doesn't really measure up to Keegan, that's for sure....

Gregor Foitek - Giedo van der Garde
VDG has nothing against a 7th and 10 DNPQs. Obviously he never had any opportunity to acheive either of those, but that doesn't matter.

Ricardo Rosset - Paolo Barilla
A couple 8ths and 9ths from Rosset do it. Barilla has nothing to match that.

Tarso Marques - Alex Yoong
Well, this really is arbitrary, isn't it? On count-back, it goes to Yoong, but I'm giving it to Marques for qualifying 14th at 1996 Argentina and only DNQing once.

Brett Lunger - Claudio Langes
Er... yeah. I'm giving it to Lunger.

Gastón Mazzacane - Alex Ribeiro
I know we all like Mazzacane better, but I'm saying Ribeiro. It's two 8th places to one, and, well, neither of them really scream "pick me" or "don't pick me" with anything they did. With a closer comparison comes less caring about who actually wins it, in a way.

David Brabham - Larry Perkins
It's another case of one really good finish (Perkins) or a few lesser finishes (Brabham), so I'm ignoring that and giving it to Perkins for all those top 20 qualifications.

Enrique Bernoldi - Pierri-Henri Raphanel
Qualifying is nice, so this one goes to Bernoldi.

Brian Henton - Rikky von Opel
von Opel has a couple 9ths, but Henton's time at Tyrrell brought him much more than that.

François Hesnault - Lucas di Grassi
A 7th and a couple 8ths beats di Grassi's year at Virgin.

Toranosuke Takagi - Martin Donnelly
They have similar high results, and I'm going to take the opposite of my usual route and give it to Donnelly for achieving it all in less time, since it'd be a bit unfair to judge things based on how long they lasted in F1.

Paul Belmondo - Gianmaria Bruni
Is it just this or did Minardi have a lot of one-season drivers? Like, way more than is normal? Jokes aside, Bruni does beat Belmondo in terms of qualifying, but the latter had a few better finishes than 14th, plus all those DNQs. But despite Belmondo being a hero, I think sanity rules in favour of Bruni.

WeirdKerr · Post by **WeirdKerr** » 07 May 2016, 09:19

Dj_bereta wrote:It's the second time in-a-row Hulkenberg is out of the race in the first lap and in turn 2 in the Russian Grand Prix.

He is in danger of becoming the new Fisichela who had incidents a lot at turn 1/2 of Brazil and Turkey(similar corners)

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 08 May 2016, 04:24

Luca Badoer - Ian Burgess
Burgess' 6th is nice, but if you look beyond one race, Badoer is better. Also, his 6th was in a 1959 Cooper, which is totally unfair compared to what Badoer got his high results with. Badoer moves on.

Roberto Guerrero - Eric van de Poele
van de Poele has one more top 10, so there's that. But really, if we're being reasonable, it has to go to Guerrero. Unfortunately.

Max Chilton - Corrado Fabi
Chilton never nearly scored, and for a good reason too. There really is nothing to save him other than lasting a bit longer, and that's not enough.

Luciano Burti - Johnny Claes
Claes benefitted from the occasional race where no one showed up, but there still isn't really anything to put Burti above him.

Jan Lammers - Jérôme d'Ambrosio
As you'd expect, Lammers has the edge with race results, but he also has the edge in qualifying, not even counting Long Beach in 1980. With three more top 20s in qualifying and three more top 10s in races, Lammers moves on.

Huub Rothengatter - Harald Ertl
They both have one 7th, and it's Rothengatter 5 and Ertl 6 on top 10s. And so it's Ertl's set of one 17th-21st each on the grid beating a sole 20th that takes him to the next round.

Patrick Nève - Will Stevens
Nève has some top tens and Stevens has better grid positions. It sure would be nice if Stevens had teammates who themselves were connected to the rest of F1, or if Nève had teammates at all, but there's no way to compare them to anything. Since it's arbitrary, Nève gets it because 1) races are more important and 2) he has a DNPQ.

Raul Boesel - Scott Speed
It's just like the previous one: one driver has better race positions for driving in an era of worse reliability, and one has better grid positions because there weren't as many cars to be behind. They both had races where they came close to scoring, although Speed does a bit better in that respect, so I'll say him.

Yannick Dalmas - Ian Scheckter
Top tens 7-1, top 20s on grid 6-11. Dalmas wins because he shouldn't really be here and for apparently crashing less.

Mike Beuttler - Allan McNish
They're very similar with high positions, but McNish is a bit better in qualifying, having more top everythings from 10th to 20th, except 11 where they're even and 12 where Beuttler wins. So for that, it goes to McNish.

Rupert Keegan - Gregor Foitek
Look at all those results from Keegan. He wins by any metric you can devise except DNPQs for EuroBrun, which admittedly is nice, but it isn't enough.

Ricardo Rosset - Tarso Marques
If you order their race results by quality and have them side-by-side, Rosset is always one to three positions ahead. The same is true for qualifying, not counting Marques' 14th I've mentioned. Rosset is the clear winner.

Brett Lunger - Alex Ribeiro
Lunger has a 7th versus Ribeiro's two 8ths, which Lunger also has. Along with a 9th and five 10ths. And he has better qualifying numbers. Lunger moves on.

Larry Perkins - Enrique Bernoldi
Both have an 8th, but Bernoldi also has a 9th and two 10ths. He has it better in qualifying as well. It's an easy choice to make.

Brian Henton - François Hesnault
Their top three results are both 7-8-8. Henton fits in another 8th, a 9th, and another 10th between two 10ths for them both. They're similar in qualifying when they did qualify, but Henton also has a lot of DNQs. Henton wins.

Martin Donnelly - Gianmaria Bruni
Donnelly has four points under Bruni's system. His qualifying is way better too. Bruni really has nothing on him.

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 10 May 2016, 05:15

Luca Badoer - Roberto Guerrero
This is where it ends for Guerrero. At this stage of the tournament, a sole 8th place isn't enough. Guerrero has some good grid places, but it doesn't make up for the lack of race results considering how big the gap is.

Corrado Fabi - Johnny Claes
With two 7ths and two 8ths from Claes, Fabi's sole 7th can only get him so far. Fabi did well from seed 40, but Claes is the obvious winner.

Jan Lammers - Harald Ertl
Lammers' best result is 9th, whereas Ertl has a 7th and three 8ths. Lammers is definitely better on grid positions, but the race is more important.

Patrick Nève - Scott Speed
Their top four positions are the same, except Nève has a 7th instead of a 9th. Of course, Speed did it during a more reliable time. Speed's qualifying record is far better, with Nève's best result being 19th, so he moves on.

Yannick Dalmas - Allan McNish
Dalmas' pleasing pattern of one 5th, two 7ths, and four 9ths is a bit better than McNish's 7th, 8th, and two 9ths. McNish has the better grid places, but I'm blaming the car, plus he has no DNPQs. Mostly the second one.

Rupert Keegan - Ricardo Rosset
Their race results are actually quite similar, so we go to qualifying, where Keegan has the edge for the first few positions, but is worse at the bottom. Since this is obviously more about the high points, Keegan gets the win.

Brett Lunger - Enrique Bernoldi
Lunger's best few races are better, but by one or two positions each time, so Bernoldi could overturn it with a better qualifying record. That gives a similar "one or two positions" result in favour of Bernoldi, but the races matter more as always, so Lunger wins.

Brian Henton - Martin Donnelly
A 7th and two 8ths for both, then Henton gets another 8th and 9th as Donnelly drops off. However, Donnelly's qualifying has so much more success, nine times in the top 15 compared to once for Henton, that it makes up for it.

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 12 May 2016, 07:25

Luca Badoer - Johnny Claes
Very similar results in the race, with Claes having an average two-position edge in the top few qualifying results, but fewer people showing up is of course the actual cause of that. I don't think Johnny Claes ever had a race where he was deserving of points, so Badoer wins the matchup.

Harald Ertl - Scott Speed
They both came within a position or two of points four times, and Speed has the better qualifying record. If it was closer, it'd go to Ertl for the race positions obviously being higher, but it isn't.

Yannick Dalmas - Rupert Keegan
Dalmas tends to be one or two positions better in the race, with Keegan one or two positions better in qualifying. So I guess it's Dalmas.

Brett Lunger - Martin Donnelly
They have the same top three race positions, after which Lunger does much better. It isn't much compared to Donnelly's continuing dominance in qualifying, though, so Donnelly moves on.

Luca Badoer - Scott Speed
This is much the same as Speed's previous match race-wise, but Badoer is barely beat in qualifying instead of being blown away. With Badoer's higher race positions, plus all his statistics being achieved with Minardi, he moves on.

Yannick Dalmas - Martin Donnelly
Is it Dalmas' legendary 5th place or Donnelly's legendary qualifications? If Dalmas had nothing to back that one race up, he would lose, but he has other high positions too, so it's he who goes through to the final.

Scott Speed - Martin Donnelly
It's 4-3 for Speed on coming within two positions of points, but Donnelly is around one or two positions better on the best few qualifying places, and along with the higher race results, that gets the Lotus-and-Arrows-that-one-time driver the win.

Luca Badoer - Yannick Dalmas
Who was robbed of points more? There are cases of heartbreaking mechanical failures all over the history of motorsport, but Dalmas' problem is a bit less common and really hard to compare to anything. It isn't by much at all, about a position on average for the first several races, but Dalmas does have the better race results. And then Badoer has better qualifying highlights by 3ish positions each time.

So, who has the better statistics? Well, Badoer shouldn't be here, but Dalmas really shouldn't be here. No one is advocating points for having a tragic mechanical failure, fastest laps aside, but the case of Dalmas still today causes annoyance at the very rules he was racing under. The race is more important and the gap in qualifying isn't big enough to make it up, so Yannick Dalmas wins this... thing I did.

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 15 May 2016, 15:07

Today marks the first time since the 2009 British Grand Prix that both the oldest and the youngest drivers on the grid shared the podium.

good_Ralf · Post by **good_Ralf** » 15 May 2016, 15:16

Today's also the first time since the 2013 Spain race that a driver other than Hamilton, Vettel, Rosberg and Ricciardo has won a Grand Prix. About bloody time. I don't think we've ever had a 3-year period in the sport's history with such a lack of different winners.

WeirdKerr · Post by **WeirdKerr** » 15 May 2016, 15:19

Simtek wrote:Today marks the first time since the 2009 British Grand Prix that both the oldest and the youngest drivers on the grid shared the podium.

Isn't Button older than Kimi?

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 15 May 2016, 15:23

WeirdKerr wrote:
Simtek wrote:Today marks the first time since the 2009 British Grand Prix that both the oldest and the youngest drivers on the grid shared the podium.

Isn't Button older than Kimi?

No, Kimi's older by about three months

Also, this is the first time that the oldest and youngest drivers on the grid have finished 1-2 since the 1992 Belgian Grand Prix, although Christian Fittipaldi DNQ'd for that race. Ignoring Fittipaldi, I think this could be the first time it's ever happened...

Dj_bereta · Post by **Dj_bereta** » 15 May 2016, 17:57

First time the championship contenders crash in the first lap since... 1990 season, right? Also, for the first time since COTA 2012, Mercedes fails to score a point.

WeirdKerr · Post by **WeirdKerr** » 15 May 2016, 18:01

First Non Australian to score a debut win in a Red Bull

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 15 May 2016, 18:59

2009 British Grand Prix, Buemi was the youngest driver on the grid, no?

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 15 May 2016, 19:03

Rob Dylan wrote:2009 British Grand Prix, Buemi was the youngest driver on the grid, no?

...bathplug.

Peteroli34 · Post by **Peteroli34** » 15 May 2016, 20:18

The Spanish GP saw the first fin for a Engine not badged as a Ferrari, Renault or Mercedes since Canada 2008.

The First win for a new engine supplier since Mugen Honda in Monaco 1996

FullMetalJack · Post by **FullMetalJack** » 15 May 2016, 20:25

Felipe Massa's stints at teams correspond perfectly with the engine regulations in Formula 1 at the time.

His entire Sauber stint was with V10s
His entire Ferrari stint was with V8s
His entire Williams stint so far has been with V6s

Bleu · Post by **Bleu** » 15 May 2016, 20:52

Last ten races in Catalunya have given ten different winners.
2007 Massa
2008 Räikkönen
2009 Button
2010 Webber
2011 Vettel
2012 Maldonado
2013 Alonso
2014 Hamilton
2015 Rosberg
2016 Verstappen

Also, every GP winner in the field with the exception of Ricciardo has won at Catalunya.