You can **** right off. Yes, YOU.

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You can **** right off. Yes, YOU.

Post by GwilymJJames »

Unless you're 70 and rich, says Shut-Up-Eccles. Are you 70 and rich? I'm not 70 and rich.

Young kids will see the Rolex brand, but are they going to go and buy one? They can't afford it. Or our other sponsor, UBS — these kids don't care about banking. They haven't got enough money to put in the bloody banks anyway. That's what I think. I don't know why people want to get to the so-called 'young generation'. Why do they want to do that? Is it to sell them something? Most of these kids haven't got any money. I'd rather get to the 70-year-old guy who's got plenty of cash. So, there's no point trying to reach these kids because they won't buy any of the products here and if marketers are aiming at this audience, then maybe they should advertise with Disney.



In other Piss off you Cantankerous Old Man news:

Nobody will miss [Caterham & Marussia] because they're not frontrunning teams; they've only got a name that people would know because of the problem they're in. If you want to get recognised you've got to do something. This poor guy in South Africa [Oscar Pistorius], for instance, has got more interest because of what happened with him than when he was winning gold medals. He won medals and afterwards nobody thought about him.



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Shut up Eccles!
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Post by Pointrox »

This Ecclestone fellow surely knows how to appeal to all audiences :roll:
It makes me even more convinced to actually bathplug right off Formula One for 2015.
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Post by DanielPT »

I've went through the news piece in Autosport and I have to say that I have never read an interview that unbelievably stupid in my life. It is nothing but a confirmation that Ecclestone doesn't care for the sport or its future any more. I think he doesn't mind taking F1 to the grave with him. He has to go before it's too late, I am afraid.
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Post by Salamander »

I think at this stage we could start a movement to declare Bernie legally blind due to his incredible amount of short-sightedness.
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Post by Bobby Doorknobs »

We love you too Bernie! (twat)
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Post by Shizuka »

GJ Bernie, you keep raising your wages for that ROTY :lol:

Code: Select all

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Post by Cynon »

That's the kind of shite you say if you're intentionally trying to kill the sport! :lol:
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Re: You can **** right off. Yes, YOU.

Post by eytl »

To adopt a JFKism:

Ask not what the sport can do for the fans, but ask what the fans can do for the big corporate sponsors.
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Post by Cynon »

eytl wrote:To adopt a JFKism:

Ask not what the sport can do for the fans, but ask what the fans can do for the big corporate sponsors.


Related, but didn't Bernie try and create a spectator-less Grand Prix some time ago? As in, only VIP guests?
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Post by tommykl »

Cynon wrote:
eytl wrote:To adopt a JFKism:

Ask not what the sport can do for the fans, but ask what the fans can do for the big corporate sponsors.


Related, but didn't Bernie try and create a spectator-less Grand Prix some time ago? As in, only VIP guests?

Yep, I think that was his plan for an eventual French Grand Prix at Paul Ricard.
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Post by DanielPT »

tommykl wrote:
Cynon wrote:
eytl wrote:To adopt a JFKism:

Ask not what the sport can do for the fans, but ask what the fans can do for the big corporate sponsors.


Related, but didn't Bernie try and create a spectator-less Grand Prix some time ago? As in, only VIP guests?

Yep, I think that was his plan for an eventual French Grand Prix at Paul Ricard.


Ecclestone's hatred for average F1 fans prevents him from perceiving that those rich folks who come to the GPs and sponsor things F1 related mostly do it for the average Joe to see them. If there isn't anyone there to see them, what would be the point? I guess that not even his recent good time spent with Putin made him see this.
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Post by Zetec »

"Bernie Ecclestone: Formula 1 doesn't need young fans"

And I say, we don't need this old pathetic bloke in F1 no more.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMFKXyIwjJM
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Post by AustralianStig »

Zetec wrote:"Bernie Ecclestone: Formula 1 doesn't need young fans"

And I say, we don't need this old pathetic bloke in F1 no more.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMFKXyIwjJM

It's ok, we'll be around for MUCH longer than he will ;)

Bernard forgets that nearly every F1 fan grew up watching races as a kid - if you don't engage the youth, they won't follow you into their adulthood.

I'm quite often the first to defend Bernie when he's being unfairly victimised, but he's truly shown himself as an utter fool this time.
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Re: You can **** right off. Yes, YOU.

Post by MorbidelliObese »

Yep, i'm 31 now but became hooked as an 8 year old.

More importantly - if I hadn't become hooked as a child, in a parallel universe and I was tuning in to F1 for the first time now, with DRS, miniscule grids, forgettable circuits, spec tyres, frozen engines, personal driver numbers and 3/4 of the drivers younger than me I'd probably switch over, only the long standing emotional attachment forged over 2 decades ago prevents me.

By all means don't pander to a particular audience and dumb down to bend to them (although funnily enough you'd be forgiven for thinking the sport had been doing that in recent years), but you need to give the kids of today the same opportunity I had to discover what you're all about and decide for themselves if they're interested or not. I had the opportunity because back then the choice was 4 TV channels or my Commodore 64 for things to do indoors, so when I stumbled across Mansell winning at Magny Cours in 1991 it was probably inevitable I would have done so at some point, less so these days when you're behind a paywall in a lot of countries and actively taking down videos online etc.
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Post by Yannick »

eytl wrote:To adopt a JFKism:

Ask not what the sport can do for the fans, but ask what the fans can do for the big corporate sponsors.


Enoch, it's good to see you. Here's wishing you all the best.
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Post by FullMetalJack »

AustralianStig wrote:It's ok, we'll be around for MUCH longer than he will ;)


Probably not. I'm 21 and I still imagine that i'll die before he does.
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Post by LellaLombardi »

This really is just facepalm to the power of facepalm.

I think he's playing a game of "If I can't run this, then no-one will" and is making sure he kills it off or leaves it in too desperate a state to continue, then retires.
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Post by Ross Prawn »

:shock: Bernie has gone completely crazy this time.
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Post by F1000X »

That knock on the head when he got robbed is really starting show it's damage.
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Post by dr-baker »

Yannick wrote:
eytl wrote:To adopt a JFKism:

Ask not what the sport can do for the fans, but ask what the fans can do for the big corporate sponsors.


Enoch, it's good to see you. Here's wishing you all the best.

I echo this sentiment. Praying that the situation improves imminently, whatever the situation may be.

As for Bernie, you can just go home now. F1 has no need for you any more. Thank you and good night.

Or else we need to start enacting this plan... ;)
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Post by Miguel98 »

Please, Bernie, if you don't like/care about the sport, give it to someone else who is smarter and cares more then you.
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Post by Barbazza »

I remember the days when the sports I like weren't run by idiots. I am now wondering if I will ever see a return to those days even if I have to live as long as Bernie (while simultaneously not becoming so obviously in need of mental help preferably)
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Post by Ferrim »

I was going to post exactly the same as the thread opener. In fact I've came here because of it.

**** ***, Bernie.

I've been asking for his resignation for years now, but it is getting old. You can't blame the man for saying stupid things, he's 84 after all, but you can and should blame him for staying at the front when he should have retired not much after the turn of the century.
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Post by andrew2209 »

As an 18 year old, you're making my dream job of becoming an Formula 1 engineer seems less exciting by the day
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Post by JJMonty »

andrew2209 wrote:As an 18 year old, you're making my dream job of becoming an Formula 1 engineer seems less exciting by the day


As a final year Motorsport Technology student at University, I know exactly how you feel - what a waste of hopes and dreams when you read such things from him! :(

Although very harsh, I can understand Bernie's views - spectators at a circuit don't really make the money anymore, it's all about corporate sponsors and Bernie is correct on that front, I don't know of many younger people who would consider buying a Rolex!
Having said that, I'm sure the F1 teams will strongly disagree with him for the exact same reasons! Their sponsors do appeal to the younger generation ... Blackberry, Monster, Red Bull, even products like Martini, Shell and Renault are more likely to appeal to them!

I must admit my interest for F1 has waned this year after all the rule changes and "gimmicks" brought in, I was looking forward to the V6 turbos! But then silly stuff like the NASCAR styled numbers and double points made me lose interest straight away! ... I was at the Silverstone test earlier in the year helping to setup for Formula Student - the F1 cars were driving around at the time, they made a nice noise - but my god they sounded uninspiring! the seemless shift gearboxes didn't help either ... ever seen a nice car at the red light, waited anxiously for it to turn green so you can hear it roar into life - only to hear the automatic gearbox kick in and it makes that dull/slipping clutch noise with no backfire etc? That's exactly what I felt at Silverstone that day! As a kid, I would have clung to the fence and got as close as I dared to the cars! However on that day, I just ignored it and got on with my own job ... thought that would never happen! I don't like the way F1 has gone, I don't like the comments such as what Bernie has said and in all honesty, I do have to say "why did I bother?" Dream shattered! Thank god there are still other forms of Motorsport to get involved in like Le Mans and WRC!
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Post by noiceinmydrink »

I've read some garbage in my time, but that's not good, Bernie boy. Time for you to go, methinks.

dr-baker wrote:
Yannick wrote:
eytl wrote:To adopt a JFKism:

Ask not what the sport can do for the fans, but ask what the fans can do for the big corporate sponsors.


Enoch, it's good to see you. Here's wishing you all the best.

I echo this sentiment. Praying that the situation improves imminently, whatever the situation may be.

I'll add to the well-wishing as well. Whatever's going on, and I will respect what you've said about disclosing and discussing the situation, here's hoping everything will be good in time.
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Post by mario »

Ferrim wrote:I was going to post exactly the same as the thread opener. In fact I've came here because of it.

**** ***, Bernie.

I've been asking for his resignation for years now, but it is getting old. You can't blame the man for saying stupid things, he's 84 after all, but you can and should blame him for staying at the front when he should have retired not much after the turn of the century.

At the same time, it also begs the question of why nobody else is demanding to know why the sport still has an 84 year old man who has been involved in a number of high profile financial and political scandals and yet still has an influential position within the sport.

CVC could, if they wanted, quite easily push Bernie out of the sport - as Joe Saward pointed out when he dug into FOM's records, Bernie has already been forced to give up a number of his functions within FOM ahead of his trial in Germany, but is yet to be reappointed to those positions, significantly weakening his leverage within FOM and with CVC. It makes you wonder what exactly Bernie is still bringing to them when CVC already reportedly have candidates lined up to replace Bernie (Stuart Rose's name has been mentioned quite a few times in the past) - he may be influential but he is not indispensable.

tommykl wrote:
Cynon wrote:
eytl wrote:To adopt a JFKism:

Ask not what the sport can do for the fans, but ask what the fans can do for the big corporate sponsors.


Related, but didn't Bernie try and create a spectator-less Grand Prix some time ago? As in, only VIP guests?

Yep, I think that was his plan for an eventual French Grand Prix at Paul Ricard.

I think that, to a certain extent, is down to the fact that, because Paul Ricard is designed as a testing facility, there are virtually no facilities for members of the paying public. I believe that Paul Ricard's official seating capacity is about 10,000 people - to put that in perspective, Monaco, a venue where the grandstands have to be squeezed between buildings and barriers, has a seating capacity of 26,000. About the only part of the track which has fairly well developed facilities would be the paddock area, since that caters for visiting teams - the area where VIP guests would tend to naturally congregate anyway.

I would assume that, because of those severe restrictions in the number of people who can actually attend the race, the proposal of having an ultra-exclusive race at Paul Ricard was mainly motivated by the fact that, since the track can only accommodate a tiny number of people, the only way to make the race even halfway viable would be if those visitors were paying a substantial premium.

And, as an aside, it is certainly good to see you back here again Enoch - here's hoping that it is a sign for better times.
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Post by sswishbone »

This whole thing beggars belief, he talks about how pointless it is going after young fans. Hamilton who adored Senna is one such example of what that youth being a fan can lead to. Bernie would do well to remember that
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Post by CoopsII »

My Dad is 73 and rich but unfortunately he finds Formula 1 dull and uninteresting so I'm not sure where that leaves Bernie and his demographic.
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Post by roblo97 »

Bernie is just being a complete Moron at the moment.
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Post by Frogfoot9013 »

If I was a racing driver now, I'd probably up stakes for the States as the idiocy of Bernie would put me off wanting to go to F1 and make IndyCar more appealing to me.
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Post by Bobby Doorknobs »

roblomas52 wrote:Bernie has been a complete moron for many years and should resign.

Fixed.

Yannick wrote:Enoch, it's good to see you. Here's wishing you all the best.

dr-baker wrote:I echo this sentiment. Praying that the situation improves imminently, whatever the situation may be.

Mexicola wrote:I'll add to the well-wishing as well. Whatever's going on, and I will respect what you've said about disclosing and discussing the situation, here's hoping everything will be good in time.

I too am hoping that this is a sign the situation will improve. As much as I would like to know what exactly is going on, it will have to wait. Best wishes Enoch :)
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Post by LionZoo »

MorbidelliObese wrote:Yep, i'm 31 now but became hooked as an 8 year old.

More importantly - if I hadn't become hooked as a child, in a parallel universe and I was tuning in to F1 for the first time now, with DRS, miniscule grids, forgettable circuits, spec tyres, frozen engines, personal driver numbers and 3/4 of the drivers younger than me I'd probably switch over, only the long standing emotional attachment forged over 2 decades ago prevents me.

By all means don't pander to a particular audience and dumb down to bend to them (although funnily enough you'd be forgiven for thinking the sport had been doing that in recent years), but you need to give the kids of today the same opportunity I had to discover what you're all about and decide for themselves if they're interested or not. I had the opportunity because back then the choice was 4 TV channels or my Commodore 64 for things to do indoors, so when I stumbled across Mansell winning at Magny Cours in 1991 it was probably inevitable I would have done so at some point, less so these days when you're behind a paywall in a lot of countries and actively taking down videos online etc.


Kind of have to agree with this. I was hooked as a kid, but I'm 30 now and probably exactly the type of audience Bernie is looking for, i.e., disposable income and looking for financial services. If I hadn't been a fan since youth (and developed into a huge petrolhead), I probably wouldn't care right now.
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Post by dr-baker »

I've only read the Autosport article to date, but also seen some headlines saying that Bernie has compared the small teams' spending to "women with credit cards." So I would interpret that as meaning that the small teams have actually been quite sensible and aware of what they are doing, although sometimes, they can find that there can be times when it is hard to make the minimum payments despite their best efforts. Right?

But I would bet my next pay cheque that Bernie was implying recklessness. And if he is, I don't think I want to marry either of his daughters any more... :?
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Post by LellaLombardi »

The fatal flaw in Bernie's argument is that the rich 70 year old fans he is so keen on will also remember a time when F1 was much better than this.
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Post by Sublime_FA11C »

I've read the article, i've read the quotes, i'm not incensed in any way.
The interview is here: http://www.campaignasia.com/Article/392 ... brand.aspx
I've gone over each Q&A, my opinions are below, feel free to disagree with me or ignore me.

What does the Formula One brand stand for?
That's a good anwser. F1 is a major sports and entertainment brand. With odd tyres, DRS, complex qualifying and other aspects F1 can appear more techincal to a casual fan than other major brands. Though football (US incl) has it's own complexities at least fans can play it and underestand it better.

How can you bring more of the entertainment factor into Formula One?
Doesn't admit but he really doesn't know. Acknowledges F1 has more competition these days. (Frankly another business would highlight the crap out of their high points and succesess, but F1 instead focuses and thrives on negativity.)

Is Formula One in crisis?
True. Crisis', controversy and complaining have been part of F1 for as long as i remember. Shrinking of the grid is a consequence of more expensive technology being developed which not all teams can afford. Teams already in heavy debt are particularly hard hit, though some are exaggerating and all accepted to be part of it.
As for teams who "sit at the poker table" without having as much money as the big players, the analogy doesn't work because poker only has one winner, the rest are out. There are no payouts to all participants either. He is right to point out that playing a game you cant afford while only hoping for a miracle hand is suicide.

Are you concerned about struggling teams and the impact this will have on F1?
Again, teams such as HRT, Caterham, Marussia and Sauber have been in a precarious position for a number of years now. It's their own choice to be in F1, even though success for them is very hard and expensive to come by.
He is ignoring the threat a reduced field would have on earnings, and that team failures would make potential newcomers to the grid think twice before joining up. Then again it might make newcomers more serious, better financed or supported by a major manufacturer right from the start. Or he's already thinking ahead to customer teams and genuinely belives there's no long term loss.
Hass' entry into F1 will be an interesting one. Like going into a minefield with a "best guess" map in hand.

Has Formula One become an impossibly expensive sport to be involved in?
The answer to this is yes, but he instead misdirects the answer. "To be involved in" you don't need to be impossibly rich, but so much will be spent on surviving that competing will be very difficult. Force India have proven it can be done to a certain extent, but every year they lose out in the development race.
"Just dont spend as much" = Settle for 5th or 8th or whatever you can reach without taking out loans.

I'll skip the questions about Asia for the most part but the point about F1 giving countries Olympics-like exposure every year is a solid one. Though it directly and firmly places "sport" in the backseat to "business" but given how expensive F1 is today, the money has to come from somewhere and he found a lot of it in Asia.
The comparison between F1 and football is again a valid point. Every kid can play football, karting is already out of reach of many kids pockets. Of course it doesn't anwser how F1 can compete with football, but i'm not sure he knows or thinks it neccesary.

What is the trend in sponsorship that you’ve seen in recent years?
Again compares F1 to oplympics that happen every few weeks. Wants sponsors to invest big into F1 rather than small amounts into lots of smaller sports teams. Neither right or wrong, just convenient for his business. Claims F1 offers a better opportunity because of it's massive audience. Ok.

How much do the teams depend on sponsorship?
Straightforward.

How much does F1 need sponsors, versus broadcasting rights or race fees?
If "cut our costs" means reduced prize money major teams might be unhappy about that because of the amounts they spend on competition. However major teams and CVC form the Strategy Group and they'd know in advance of the problem and would work around it.

What does a major brand such as Rolex get for its Formula One sponsorship that other sports properties can’t offer?
Pretty straightforward anwser. Makes a point how it's up to sponsors to make use of their investment and praises Rolex and Red Bull in particular for doing a good job. Ok...

What’s the secret to Red Bull’s marketing success?
"keeps his brand in front of the public all the time" ... yadda yadda, more straightforward stuff.

Could Formula One benefit from marketing itself more?
"What could we say to people? It’s pretty obvious what we produce and what we do. Either people like it and buy or don’t like it." Straightforward as before. Adds that he is taking flack for declining TV audiences, then deflects it by saying viewership is down for all sports and audiences have more to choose from. Also indirectly and very ambiguously ackgnowledges that a lot of people figured out how to watch F1 without "officially" watching it (and paying for it). They are also not counted.

How can Formula One widen its reach (beyond television) to expand its audience base?
I have no idea why he responded by talking about how he doesn't understand tweeting or Facebook. Says he doesn't understand social media, admits not knowing what young generation of today wants. While he avoids anwsering the question, there is nothing irritating here.

Do you believe there is no value in reaching this young audience?
That is a bullshit question with an obvious anwser, and a less obvious catch. It's also another one that ticked a lot of people off, and i think it's deliberate.
Says that F1 corporate sponsors (Rolex, UBS, Singapore or Emirates airlines) are of little interest to young people (true), that F1's global reach and large audience are best suited for corporate, world-wide sponsorship (true) but goes off about targeted branding aiming at 15 year olds, how kids can't afford Rolexes (no, but they understand it's a rich-man watch), don't care about banking and attacks trying to chase and pander to younger audiences, going as far as to state such advertising belongs on Disney.
No mention of Red Bull's very succesfull advertising campaign this time, and no mention of any team sponsorship at all. For reference sponsors not mentioned include: Martini, Smirnoff, Johnnie Walker... you get the idea.

But can’t social media help you build or amplify fan engagement?
"How are you going to get all the fans to meet these drivers, who don’t even want to meet their girlfriends? You’re right that we should use social media to promote Formula One. I just don’t know how." = "F*** you, thank you, you're right." Glorious reply there. :D
Beyond that just repeats not really understaning how to make social media work for him. Possibly avoids another link between young audiences who are social media savvy and lots of tweet pics of F1 cars screaming "Bernie says: If you want to DRINK AND DRIVE, vodka Red Bulls are the best."

What’s next for Formula One?
Wants to retain audience, acknowledges it can't be grown. I'm not sure i buy that but i don't know the figures.

What drives you? What do you say to the critics?
"I’m a firefighter. When the fires start, I have to put them out and we’re always having fires." Ok.
"I don’t say anything to these people because the majority of them don’t have the slightest idea what they’re talking about." True.

Full interview: http://www.campaignasia.com/Article/392 ... brand.aspx
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LellaLombardi
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Re: You can **** right off. Yes, YOU.

Post by LellaLombardi »

Motorsport has probably the weakest development program of any major sport. The BBC has an initiative called "Get Inspired" where you can visit a website and get information on how to take up a sport after watching it on TV. Gymnastics has signed up to this in a big way. But if you click on the motorsport one, it basically says "Most drivers start in karting" and that's it.

Unless you have a rich daddy who can spend tens of thousands of pounds a year on karting (I'm looking at you, Max Chilton) then you can't hope to go anywhere. Some of the larger tracks have a kids club, but it's still very expensive and these drivers will only race within their own environment - they're not part of any series.

I took part in the University karting league when I was younger and I was good even if I say so myself (although being seven stone in those days helped). But if Mini Lella wants to do it, she can forget it. There's no track within 90 minutes drive of here.

The FIA should be investing in better sports development rather than leaving it to the likes of Red Bull. They don't seem to realise than for many people - especially children - a big part of being a fan of a sport is participating in it.
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shinji
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Re: You can **** right off. Yes, YOU.

Post by shinji »

It's good though because with views like this his hypothesis will be tested very soon. Young fans have to be engaged with something to maintain their commitment and interest. F1 could very rapidly lose such fans.

But the over 70s will still be in the Paddock Club at the track so no worries! :D
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Re: You can **** right off. Yes, YOU.

Post by Ataxia »

I saw a theory where Bernie's trying to insinuate the demographic of F1 is, well, older people in order to stop any ban of alcohol sponsorship...which kinda makes sense. If Bernie pretends that the target audience doesn't include children, then it might serve to quell any fears that sponsorship of alcoholic beverages are being targeted at the young.

Of course, that could be rubbish, but we all know the words that come out of Bernie's mouth usually mean something...be it a hidden agenda or angling for more investors, whatever.
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Leyton House
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Re: You can **** right off. Yes, YOU.

Post by Leyton House »

Bernie has a history of saying weird things to divert attention from something else, (remember the Hitler comments?) I'm sure this is nothing more than that. I think he wants to give the press something else to discuss than the financial mess F1 is in.
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