2014 Silly Season Thread

[takagi_for_the_win]

Having read this news, I am afraid to say that I'm going to have to leave this forum for a short while to undertake an arduous journey.

I shall travel to deepest, darkest Bavaria, go to the finest wurst shop in Munich, buy their largest and heaviest sausage, and then schlep back to Enstone, and proceed to clobber the shite out of Mr Bouillon and the Lotus board with it.

I'm going outside. I may be some time

[UncreativeUsername37]

Cynon shared this on the chat just now. Waiting for a trusted source to pick up on it now...

This must be some sort of pathetic, hateful joke.

Dear F1 Rejects,

If this story is true, I would like one of you to murder me in a hilarious way so that it's actually newsworthy.

Thank you.

Can you PM me your address?

[takagi_for_the_win]

Cynon shared this on the chat just now. Waiting for a trusted source to pick up on it now...

This must be some sort of pathetic, hateful joke.

Dear F1 Rejects,

If this story is true, I would like one of you to murder me in a hilarious way so that it's actually newsworthy.

Thank you.

If you really want, I could bring back another Bavarian culinary speciality and do the deed with that How does death by sauerkraut sound to you?

[Cynon]

Cynon shared this on the chat just now. Waiting for a trusted source to pick up on it now...

This must be some sort of pathetic, hateful joke.

Dear F1 Rejects,

If this story is true, I would like one of you to murder me in a hilarious way so that it's actually newsworthy.

Thank you.

Would this work?

[Hound55]

oh no. Oh god no. no no no nononononononononono.

Goddammit Quantum! Why must you ruin everything we worked so hard for? Maldonado! But the Hulk?

*denial begins*

[go_Rubens]

Cynon shared this on the chat just now. Waiting for a trusted source to pick up on it now...

This must be some sort of pathetic, hateful joke.

Maldonado actually has driving talent, but he doesn't use it wisely. But I don't quite think it is a hateful joke, as much as it is a dumb decision, if it even is true.

[eagleash]

It has now been Tweeted by Crofty & Natalie Pinkham, so the rumour, if it is such, is gathering momentum.
The Pastor, as noted above, does have ability, & has not blotted his copybook quite so much recently. .
It is, however, a decision driven mostly by his sponsorship money. & him & Grosjean (also better behaved these days) in the same team might be interesting.
Once again, how does this leave Williams if they lose the PDSVA money. It does leave a seat open for Massa, but could they afford him (or Ross Brawn come to that).

[wsrgo]

Also hearing, Chilton has 12 million in hand for a Force India. http://t.co/YRzm3XJ8Sy

So this is the prize of getting thrashed by a teammate now? Moving up to a better team?

And I'm dead serious here, so please, no mention of ChiltonCraze or MaxiMania..

[Collieafc]

Also hearing, Chilton has 12 million in hand for a Force India. http://t.co/YRzm3XJ8Sy

So this is the prize of getting thrashed by a teammate now? Moving up to a better team?

And I'm dead serious here, so please, no mention of ChiltonCraze or MaxiMania..

It seems to be the way of F1 at the moment - increased career longevity has meant that the only way to stay is to be either in a front end team already (basically the entire "top 5" main drivers and some "2nd" drivers), in one of said "Top 5" driver programs, if they have one (Red Bull/Torro Rosso, McLaren) or Lots of Money (Which is all bar the Hulk, Di Reista and maybe one or two others).

[Ataxia]

In my own biased opinion, Hulkenberg is at least a top-six driver (with Hamilton, Alonso, Vettel, Raikkonen and Rosberg) and the fact that he's due to miss out on an F1 seat is a travesty. Had a contract drawn up for Ferrari, shafted aside for Raikkonen. Favoured by Lotus, but can't get the required investment to sign him. This is fifty shades of messed up.

Perhaps I'm being a bit melodramatic, but I feel that something like this should serve as a wake-up call to the commercial environment in which F1 lives.

[Londoner]

Adrian Sutil isn't a fan of teenage drivers.

Translation: he's starting to feel the heat of trying to retain his seat.

[Dj_bereta]

A chance for Valsecchi?

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/111000

[Whole Spanish Press]

My yearly two cents:

Argentine press citing Facundo Regalia in an interview.

He says he missed Silverstone test due to lack of money asked by Force India.

More importantly, that there are conversations with Force India, Caterham and Lotus. Though is clearly ommited that it would be as reserve driver, I'm inclined to believe he says so.

Source: http://www.clarin.com/deportes/Facundo- ... 98146.html

[Samster]

You know, I'd be all for Malders getting the Lotus drive as I still feel he has talent and I'm interested in seeing how he'd do in a car that's consistently towards the front. If only it would be at literally anyone's expense but Hulkenberg's. Seriously, what an earth has this guy got to do to get a top drive? I'd even go as far to say that he's one of the top 5 drivers currently on the grid behind only the champions bar Button, yet he's stuck with the midfielders. If this happens then my interest in current F1 will truly be at an all time low (though its still better than Massa getting the drive).

[mario]

Adrian Sutil isn't a fan of teenage drivers.

Translation: he's starting to feel the heat of trying to retain his seat.

It's notable that another critic of the young drivers coming through the ranks is Massa, another driver who is similarly struggling for a seat in 2014 (whereas Hamilton, a driver who does have a seat for next year, has been taking a more neutral tone with regards to the new drivers for 2014).

It has now been Tweeted by Crofty & Natalie Pinkham, so the rumour, if it is such, is gathering momentum.
The Pastor, as noted above, does have ability, & has not blotted his copybook quite so much recently. .
It is, however, a decision driven mostly by his sponsorship money. & him & Grosjean (also better behaved these days) in the same team might be interesting.
Once again, how does this leave Williams if they lose the PDSVA money. It does leave a seat open for Massa, but could they afford him (or Ross Brawn come to that).

They might possibly be able to afford Massa - it was suggested in one or two articles that Massa has been able to pick up some Brazilian sponsors (Petrobras's name has come up), so it is possible that he might be able to raise enough sponsorship to tip things in his favour. Williams as a whole would be in a rather difficult financial situation without PDVSA though: they might be OK in the short term, since I imagine that PDVSA would have to pay compensation for breaking its contract with them, but that might only last for about a year. With that in mind, 2014 might be OK but 2015 could see problems beginning to emerge when PDVSA's parting cash pile runs low.

You know, I'd be all for Malders getting the Lotus drive as I still feel he has talent and I'm interested in seeing how he'd do in a car that's consistently towards the front. If only it would be at literally anyone's expense but Hulkenberg's. Seriously, what an earth has this guy got to do to get a top drive? I'd even go as far to say that he's one of the top 5 drivers currently on the grid behind only the champions bar Button, yet he's stuck with the midfielders. If this happens then my interest in current F1 will truly be at an all time low (though its still better than Massa getting the drive).

I would agree that Hulkenberg's performances, both in junior series and in the midfield, indicate that he would be more than capable of competing at the sharp end of the grid if he had the car to do the job.

Unfortunately, it seems that Hulkenberg has been somewhat out of sync with the rest of the grid - his strongest performances in 2012 came after the other leading teams had already renewed their contracts for 2013, which kind of put him in a bad position for this year when it came to picking a team. This year, by contrast, there are relatively few opportunities with leading teams and part of the problem was that, with Kimi on the market at the same time, Hulkenberg was overshadowed by him when talking to both Red Bull and Ferrari, whilst Lotus, the one team that was keen on him, cannot afford him as their finances have never really recovered since Renault withdrew its support from the team. As for McLaren, the rumours are that Honda are lobbying McLaren heavily to hire Alonso for 2015, so Hulkenberg is effectively being shut out from there by a driver that doesn't drive for McLaren and might not drive for them in 2015 at all.

[eytl]

Perhaps I'm being a bit melodramatic, but I feel that something like this should serve as a wake-up call to the commercial environment in which F1 lives.

No, I think that's not being melodramatic at all.

Just done a quick count of what the entry list will look like next year, and I can only count about 11 drivers at most (Vettel, Ricciardo, Hamilton, Rosberg, Alonso, Raikkonen, Button, Vergne, Kvyat and perhaps Bottas, maybe Grosjean) who are on the grid purely on merit, where sponsorship doesn't appear to be a factor (even though marketability, e.g. Kvyat in Russia, might be). The rest will all appear to be linked to a sponsor or bringing money in some way. That's half the grid! Which is not to say that "pay drivers" wouldn't also deserve a seat on talent (e.g. Max Chilton (!)), but still ...

And to think that most of those 11 drivers above are with the teams that are benefiting most from the latest Concorde Agreement ... no wonder there are fears that F1 is heading down a path where there will only be a few teams selling customer cars to the rest.

[go_Rubens]

In my own biased opinion, Hulkenberg is at least a top-six driver (with Hamilton, Alonso, Vettel, Raikkonen and Rosberg) and the fact that he's due to miss out on an F1 seat is a travesty. Had a contract drawn up for Ferrari, shafted aside for Raikkonen. Favoured by Lotus, but can't get the required investment to sign him. This is fifty shades of messed up.

Perhaps I'm being a bit melodramatic, but I feel that something like this should serve as a wake-up call to the commercial environment in which F1 lives.

1) I feel I am one of the people who thinks Maldonado is actually a talented driver and that he can perform. But the fact of the matter is, Hülkenberg is the one who should be in the Lotus seat. Maldonado could do well, but I think a better team could destroy his ability to control himself, or make him buckle under pressure. I wouldn't consider it a bad thing for Maldonado to be signed, but you never know. Remember, mal in Spanish is bad.

2) I don't think you are being melodramatic, I would have reacted the same way (if I didn't respect Maldonado's hidden abilities, but even that doesn't do much), so it isn't an overreaction. But yes, F1's commercial environment is making too much of an impact on the drivers who drive the cars in this sport. Hülk clearly has the talent to succeed, and so does Bianchi, in a more hidden form. But the fact that leaves these drivers left out is that they have close to no personal sponsors, so the fact that they don't bring money gets many drivers's paddle blade snapped off the shaft (so, their chances are much harder or lost). It goes to show that F1 is anymore a business than actually a racing championship many are lead to believe (if you are insane enough to believe that, like me).

[Alextrax52]

In my own biased opinion, Hulkenberg is at least a top-six driver (with Hamilton, Alonso, Vettel, Raikkonen and Rosberg) and the fact that he's due to miss out on an F1 seat is a travesty. Had a contract drawn up for Ferrari, shafted aside for Raikkonen. Favoured by Lotus, but can't get the required investment to sign him. This is fifty shades of messed up.

Perhaps I'm being a bit melodramatic, but I feel that something like this should serve as a wake-up call to the commercial environment in which F1 lives.

1) I feel I am one of the people who thinks Maldonado is actually a talented driver and that he can perform. But the fact of the matter is, Hülkenberg is the one who should be in the Lotus seat. Maldonado could do well, but I think a better team could destroy his ability to control himself, or make him buckle under pressure. I wouldn't consider it a bad thing for Maldonado to be signed, but you never know. Remember, mal in Spanish is bad.

2) I don't think you are being melodramatic, I would have reacted the same way (if I didn't respect Maldonado's hidden abilities, but even that doesn't do much), so it isn't an overreaction. But yes, F1's commercial environment is making too much of an impact on the drivers who drive the cars in this sport. Hülk clearly has the talent to succeed, and so does Bianchi, in a more hidden form. But the fact that leaves these drivers left out is that they have close to no personal sponsors, so the fact that they don't bring money gets many drivers's paddle blade snapped off the shaft (so, their chances are much harder or lost). It goes to show that F1 is anymore a business than actually a racing championship many are lead to believe (if you are insane enough to believe that, like me).

I think that's hit the nail on the head. Any other driver and we'd be saying that Maldonado would be a great fit for the Lotus seat. But the fact is that he is being considered over a man who's driven his socks off in the 2nd half of the year primarily because Lotus need the money and that has led most people to use the reason of Maldonado carrying the PDVSA sponsorship in his pocket as the only reason why he's in contention for the Lotus drive.

The other rumor which says a lot about where the sport is heading is the rumors concerning Chilton going to Force India and i can't see any other reason other than the AON backing as why he's being considered for that seat because in all departments this year Bianchi has battered Chilton and so it would be a sad reflection on the current state of the sport

[mario]

The other rumor which says a lot about where the sport is heading is the rumors concerning Chilton going to Force India and i can't see any other reason other than the AON backing as why he's being considered for that seat because in all departments this year Bianchi has battered Chilton and so it would be a sad reflection on the current state of the sport

I am curious about that suggestion, since I have not come across that particular rumour (the BBC have suggested in the past that Force India were evaluating the possibility of replacing di Resta with Hulkenberg - in part because Sutil has managed to secure more financial backing than di Resta - even if it seems that Hulkenberg might not have left the team on the best of terms).

[Aerospeed]

Hamilton says that Brawn was not essential to Mercedes...

I thought Brawn was one of the main reasons why he wanted to join Mercedes in the first place? This is curious...

[Alextrax52]

Hamilton says that Brawn was not essential to Mercedes...

I thought Brawn was one of the main reasons why he wanted to join Mercedes in the first place? This is curious...

I don't understand all this constant change in Lewis's emotions and stuff because it's all we've heard from him all year long. One minute he's all doom and gloom complaining about the car and how emotionally unstable he is and the next he's all nice and happy and back in the game as we heard in Hungary. If Brawn joins Mclaren I could probably see Lewis return "home"

[Cynon]

The other rumor which says a lot about where the sport is heading is the rumors concerning Chilton going to Force India and i can't see any other reason other than the AON backing as why he's being considered for that seat because in all departments this year Bianchi has battered Chilton and so it would be a sad reflection on the current state of the sport

I am curious about that suggestion, since I have not come across that particular rumour (the BBC have suggested in the past that Force India were evaluating the possibility of replacing di Resta with Hulkenberg - in part because Sutil has managed to secure more financial backing than di Resta - even if it seems that Hulkenberg might not have left the team on the best of terms).

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/chilt ... ia-return/

Perhaps I'm being a bit melodramatic, but I feel that something like this should serve as a wake-up call to the commercial environment in which F1 lives.

No, I think that's not being melodramatic at all.

Just done a quick count of what the entry list will look like next year, and I can only count about 11 drivers at most (Vettel, Ricciardo, Hamilton, Rosberg, Alonso, Raikkonen, Button, Vergne, Kvyat and perhaps Bottas, maybe Grosjean) who are on the grid purely on merit, where sponsorship doesn't appear to be a factor (even though marketability, e.g. Kvyat in Russia, might be). The rest will all appear to be linked to a sponsor or bringing money in some way. That's half the grid! Which is not to say that "pay drivers" wouldn't also deserve a seat on talent (e.g. Max Chilton (!)), but still ...

And to think that most of those 11 drivers above are with the teams that are benefiting most from the latest Concorde Agreement ... no wonder there are fears that F1 is heading down a path where there will only be a few teams selling customer cars to the rest.

Maybe I'm crazy, but I would actually be interested in a F1 grid comprised entirely of pay drivers with only like, one exception. Especially since the driver lineups would be potentially wonderful for this website.

[AustralianStig]

All ChiltonCraze jokes aside, I actually think Max Chilton is worthy of a drive with a midfield team. (Perhaps this should be in the Unpopular Opinions thread)

While his pace isn't the greatest, he's hardly put a foot wrong and hasn't had a retirement yet in his first season of F1 (would that be a record?).

Unfortunately, there are other drivers who are definitely MORE worthy of a drive than him, that don't have the money he has.

[mario]

Perhaps I'm being a bit melodramatic, but I feel that something like this should serve as a wake-up call to the commercial environment in which F1 lives.

No, I think that's not being melodramatic at all.

Just done a quick count of what the entry list will look like next year, and I can only count about 11 drivers at most (Vettel, Ricciardo, Hamilton, Rosberg, Alonso, Raikkonen, Button, Vergne, Kvyat and perhaps Bottas, maybe Grosjean) who are on the grid purely on merit, where sponsorship doesn't appear to be a factor (even though marketability, e.g. Kvyat in Russia, might be). The rest will all appear to be linked to a sponsor or bringing money in some way. That's half the grid! Which is not to say that "pay drivers" wouldn't also deserve a seat on talent (e.g. Max Chilton (!)), but still ...

And to think that most of those 11 drivers above are with the teams that are benefiting most from the latest Concorde Agreement ... no wonder there are fears that F1 is heading down a path where there will only be a few teams selling customer cars to the rest.

I suppose that the situation of some hybrid pay drivers makes things a little more complex - I'm thinking of Bianchi as one example. Whilst it is true that Ferrari have undoubtedly eased his passage into the sport, at the same time it could be argued that he has shown enough potential that most would give him a seat on merit. How about Pic or Sutil? Drivers that could probably retain a seat on merit, both being competent enough drivers, but with money playing its part too.

I kind of prefer the definition that Joe Saward has adopted of a pay driver - a driver who relies on sponsorship to make up his performance deficit on track, as on his own he would not bring in enough points, and therefore money from the WCC payments, to offset his demands. A figure like Sutil, for example, may be connected with sponsorship; were he without sponsorship, though, the steady way in which he scores points would probably still offset his wage demands. Gutierrez, on the other hand, does fit that definition of the pay driver - at the moment, his backing from the Slim family is worth more to the team than his ability to score points.

[IceG]

Judging by Kimi's comments, reported here: http://www.espn.co.uk/abudhabi/motorspo ... 33115.html, suggesting that he hasn't been paid for 2013 might indicate that the Hulkenberg would be ill-advised to go to Lotus.

[Eifelland]

Judging by Kimi's comments, reported here: http://www.espn.co.uk/abudhabi/motorspo ... 33115.html, suggesting that he hasn't been paid for 2013 might indicate that the Hulkenberg would be ill-advised to go to Lotus.

Then again, if the car is as good as this years machine, and he did well, he could snag a ride to an even better team, when the time arose...

[mario]

Judging by Kimi's comments, reported here: http://www.espn.co.uk/abudhabi/motorspo ... 33115.html, suggesting that he hasn't been paid for 2013 might indicate that the Hulkenberg would be ill-advised to go to Lotus.

Then again, if the car is as good as this years machine, and he did well, he could snag a ride to an even better team, when the time arose...

If Lotus are in as much financial difficulty as some think, that is likely to have an impact on the development of their 2014 contender - Boullier has admitted that Lotus soon found themselves out developed because they lack the resources to develop this car and the 2014 one.
On top of that, their technical department is a little more depleted - Allison's departure is likely to be the most keenly felt, though losing their head of CFD was also a major blow - so you have to wonder if, sooner or later, that is going to bite into their competitiveness. They have punched above their weight for a while now given their resources, but it might be asking a bit too much of them to manage to do that for three years in a row at a time - especially given the anticipated sharp increase in costs for 2014 will put even greater pressure on budgets than before.

Ironically, it does seem that Abu Dhabi draws out the financial issues of Lotus more than any other venue, perhaps because it is now towards the end of a season (when resources are likely to be running thin). 2012 saw Lotus, reportedly, come close to not competing at all after the mechanics threatened to go on strike after not receiving their wages (incidentally, for all the attention that Kimi is getting, I imagine that the mechanics are probably in a worse financial situation than Kimi is), and now we have Kimi claiming that he is not being paid either.

[Jocke1]

Is Romain being paid?

[Alextrax52]

Is Romain being paid?

He has stated that the monetary issues have been holding up the contract talks as to whether he'll stay for 2014 while the team confirm he has already signed.

http://www.planetf1.com/driver/18227/89 ... d-for-2014

[mario]

Is Romain being paid?

Possibly, although, as Freeze-O-Kimi points out, Grosjean has also brought up Lotus's financial difficulties; then again, Grosjean's salary is thought to be considerably smaller than Kimi's salary (the figures being thrown about at the moment put Grosjean on €500,000 a year against €3 million for Kimi), so cashflow might not be so much of an issue when dealing with him.

Mind you, earlier in the year the indication was that Lotus's problems were not so much to do with paying the basic salary, but in paying the bonus revenue that Kimi got for every point. A figure of €50,000 a point is being suggested, which would equate to about €9.15 million in bonus payments if that figure is correct - I have not yet seen a suggested figure for what Grosjean gets in bonus payments for each point scored, assuming that Lotus do pay him a bonus per point, but it is likely to be smaller than what Kimi is getting too. Lotus did specifically mention bonus payments to their lead driver (i.e. Kimi) as the reason why their total wage costs for the year had risen by about 9% in their latest financial accounts, so the problem was there in 2012 too.

[Sublime_FA11C]

Ouch. If Lotus are unable to deliver a decent car next year, do we really really want to see Hulk there in 2014? Nico needs a top flight car to prove/disprove his rumored talent and another year in a midfield car that is struggleing to perform/develop would hardly be it. If Lotus are really serious about going after Pastor, it makes me wonder just how badly they might fall. Sure Pastor won and has pace, but lacks brains imo and if Lotus sign him, it's purely for the money.

Force India otoh have been remarkably competitive this year until Pirelli was forced to change tyres and destroy FI's design. I think i'd prefer to see Hulkenberg in Perez's McLaren ideally, but DiResta's FI may be a good choice too, probably much better choice than Lotus. Force India generally tend to produce unremarkable but solid results. But then where does that leave Grosjean, who has recently raised his game and is sometimes the only man to force Vettel to turn on traction control. Or Di Resta? Or Sutil?

Not enough teams in F1 for all the talent. Or do i simply lack faith in Lotus?

[Rusujuur]

Ouch. If Lotus are unable to deliver a decent car next year, do we really really want to see Hulk there in 2014? Nico needs a top flight car to prove/disprove his rumored talent and another year in a midfield car that is struggleing to perform/develop would hardly be it. If Lotus are really serious about going after Pastor, it makes me wonder just how badly they might fall. Sure Pastor won and has pace, but lacks brains imo and if Lotus sign him, it's purely for the money.

Force India otoh have been remarkably competitive this year until Pirelli was forced to change tyres and destroy FI's design. I think i'd prefer to see Hulkenberg in Perez's McLaren ideally, but DiResta's FI may be a good choice too, probably much better choice than Lotus. Force India generally tend to produce unremarkable but solid results. But then where does that leave Grosjean, who has recently raised his game and is sometimes the only man to force Vettel to turn on traction control. Or Di Resta? Or Sutil?

Not enough teams in F1 for all the talent. Or do i simply lack faith in Lotus?

Well, FI lost out with the tires but Sauber gained just as much IMO. Currently I would say that Hulk should remain in Sauber as there seems to be money coming in for Sauber and he would retain his team leader status. Lotus is a question mark for next year - their car will not have much input from Allison & co, no money as it seems and a possibly weak Renault engine. I really cant understand why Lotus has not found a sponsor, are they asking too much money or what? Ok, I understand that last year might have been more difficult but they were very successful and talked about so they should have found someone over the winter.

[mario]

Ouch. If Lotus are unable to deliver a decent car next year, do we really really want to see Hulk there in 2014? Nico needs a top flight car to prove/disprove his rumored talent and another year in a midfield car that is struggleing to perform/develop would hardly be it. If Lotus are really serious about going after Pastor, it makes me wonder just how badly they might fall. Sure Pastor won and has pace, but lacks brains imo and if Lotus sign him, it's purely for the money.

Force India otoh have been remarkably competitive this year until Pirelli was forced to change tyres and destroy FI's design. I think i'd prefer to see Hulkenberg in Perez's McLaren ideally, but DiResta's FI may be a good choice too, probably much better choice than Lotus. Force India generally tend to produce unremarkable but solid results. But then where does that leave Grosjean, who has recently raised his game and is sometimes the only man to force Vettel to turn on traction control. Or Di Resta? Or Sutil?

Not enough teams in F1 for all the talent. Or do i simply lack faith in Lotus?

Well, FI lost out with the tires but Sauber gained just as much IMO. Currently I would say that Hulk should remain in Sauber as there seems to be money coming in for Sauber and he would retain his team leader status. Lotus is a question mark for next year - their car will not have much input from Allison & co, no money as it seems and a possibly weak Renault engine. I really cant understand why Lotus has not found a sponsor, are they asking too much money or what? Ok, I understand that last year might have been more difficult but they were very successful and talked about so they should have found someone over the winter.

I guess that another issue is the departure of Kimi - his presence within the team has given them grater coverage than they might normally get, so losing him is likely to see them fade into the background. Reduced coverage would reduce their value to a sponsor, so perhaps some sponsors are looking are taking a pessimistic view of Lotus's long term exposure.

[Backmarker]

Not enough teams in F1 for all the talent. Or do i simply lack faith in Lotus?

I don't think more teams would help, unless we were managing to add teams with large finances. Adding two teams would merely open up four spaces for pay drivers - so Davide Valsecchi, Luiz Razia, Bruno Senna and Narain Karthikeyan (for example), rather than better drivers.

[IceG]

The SkyTV team were trailing Magnusson at Marussia next season (backed by Mclaren money) very heavily during FP2 commentary. They suggested GVDG being replaced at Caterham by the displaced Chilton.

They also reviewed the pay driver vs. pay driver with talent vs. talented driver with no money debate. They too considered that Hulkenberg without a top-flight seat (or even any seat!) would be unjust.

Red Bull, Mercedes, Mclaren and Ferrari can afford to just buy the best. So I think that Alonso jumping ship to Mclaren for 2014 (with attendant knock-on moves), or Hulkenberg replacing Perez, are real possibilities.

Williams' admirable commitment to independence and brutal treatment of drivers seems to have balanced money vs. talent in the past but they obviously need something to replace the lost revenue from recent race results.

Lotus looks like an implosion waiting to happen; if they go under or drop back substantially then there are some serious questions to be posed about the whole F1 funding fiasco and its future as the pinnacle of motorsport. Maldonado may provide a one-year stop-gap.

The rest of the grid (except Toro Rosso, which has a different purpose) must look to drivers bringing revenue: the judgement is whether a weaker but wealthy driver is better than a strong driver who could deliver funding through performance and thus points. Any team that goes for a poor pay driver, just to survive, has very little chance of improving performance-wise as a team and are there just to make up numbers. Sad but that is where we seem to be.

[eytl]

The rest of the grid (except Toro Rosso, which has a different purpose) must look to drivers bringing revenue: the judgement is whether a weaker but wealthy driver is better than a strong driver who could deliver funding through performance and thus points. Any team that goes for a poor pay driver, just to survive, has very little chance of improving performance-wise as a team and are there just to make up numbers. Sad but that is where we seem to be.

Interesting point. And it just goes to show that F1 is, apart from continuing the inexorable move from sport to business, also continuing the move from a driver's sport to a team's sport. There seems to be so little room for a driver to make a difference that it's not worth not bringing in the extra $ for car development.

[Shizuka]

The SkyTV team were trailing Magnussen at Marussia next season (backed by Mclaren money) very heavily during FP2 commentary. They suggested GVDG being replaced at Caterham by the displaced Chilton.

Fixed. Magnussen would be backed by McLaren, so it's not impossible. This would make things interesting though: Marussia using Ferrari engines with McLaren technical assistance, and the drivers would be from the Ferrari and McLaren young drivers' program respectively. I have never seen anything like that.

They also reviewed the pay driver vs. pay driver with talent vs. talented driver with no money debate. They too considered that Hulkenberg without a top-flight seat (or even any seat!) would be unjust.

Hülkenberg's season isn't like Kubica's 2010 one was, but yes, he has really raised the game since the Monza Q3 lap of his. But Red Bull is locked, so is Mercedes. Ferrari is a maybe, but I doubt it.

Red Bull, Mercedes, Mclaren and Ferrari can afford to just buy the best. So I think that Alonso jumping ship to Mclaren for 2014 (with attendant knock-on moves), or Hulkenberg replacing Perez, are real possibilities.

Perez could only be booted off, if McLaren already has a valuable title sponsor. We all expect Telmex to take Vodafone's position from 2014. So until there's someone else, the Mexican will stay.
Alonso to McLaren is interesting, but I don't know how much influence does Ron Dennis have over there since his place is taken over by Whitmarsh. About Whitmarsh: shouldn't he be axed for this - so far - ridiculously bad season?
Hülkenberg could be a good idea - Button wouldn't mind that if the German is faster, but there should be a little technical direction interference between the two. Their driving styles require different setups and development in my opinion.

Williams' admirable commitment to independence and brutal treatment of drivers seems to have balanced money vs. talent in the past but they obviously need something to replace the lost revenue from recent race results.

How much money would Massa's Petrobras pack could bring? Also, why do I have a feeling that a certain B. Senna will be involved in all this for some reason? If PDVSA will move out, there will be a need for a title sponsor.

Lotus looks like an implosion waiting to happen; if they go under or drop back substantially then there are some serious questions to be posed about the whole F1 funding fiasco and its future as the pinnacle of motorsport. Maldonado may provide a one-year stop-gap.

I agree: Lotus seems to be in a dangerous situation, in fact, since the Lotus sponsorship days. A one-year deal is intriguing, but how would it work out for them after 2014? Who would be the new driver then? And more important: who would be bringing the required cash?

The rest of the grid (except Toro Rosso, which has a different purpose) must look to drivers bringing revenue: the judgement is whether a weaker but wealthy driver is better than a strong driver who could deliver funding through performance and thus points. Any team that goes for a poor pay driver, just to survive, has very little chance of improving performance-wise as a team and are there just to make up numbers. Sad but that is where we seem to be.

Toro Rosso's management is dodgy. Okay, now Ricciardo moves on and Kyvat steps in, but what if 2011 happens all over again? It will be floating in the air like the sword of Damocles, but one could only think of sacking of both Squire and Buemi...

[LellaLombardi]

Hulkenberg and Perez would be a great, if highly unlikely, line up at McLaren. I don't think Perez should be booted off for this season, sure he hasn't fulfilled his potential but he's had the measure of Button and I don't think anyone could have got much more out of that dog of a car. He'll have to raise his game next year though.

[mario]

Hulkenberg and Perez would be a great, if highly unlikely, line up at McLaren. I don't think Perez should be booted off for this season, sure he hasn't fulfilled his potential but he's had the measure of Button and I don't think anyone could have got much more out of that dog of a car. He'll have to raise his game next year though.

I wouldn't say that Perez has really had the measure of Button - they are more or less even in qualifying performances (Button is currently slightly ahead, at 9-8 in his favour), and Perez has only managed to beat Button three times in the races where both drivers finished (in Bahrain, Canada and India respectively).
In terms of race results, if we exclude DNF's Button has only finished outside of the top 10 three times this season compared to six non points finishes for Perez, and points wise Button has 60 points to 33 for Perez. All in all, the relative positions in the WDC and respective points haul would indicate that Button has generally had a better run of form than Perez this season.

Back to the topic of Hulkenberg, it seems that there is at least some hope for him staying on the grid for 2014 - Sky Sports claim that Force India have offered him a two year deal, although it is uncertain which driver he would be replacing. It's probably little more than a lateral move, but compared to the prospect of being left off the grid altogether, any midfield seat looks better than none right now. http://www1.skysports.com/f1/news/12473 ... -f1-future

[Jocke1]

Will we ever see a New Jersey GP?

Added: 3 hours ago
Breaking news
2014 calendar to shrink by two races - reports
New Jersey and Mexico are the two Grand Prixs that will be cut from the 2014 Formula One calendar.

Nov.3 (GMM) F1's bustling 2014 calendar looks set to shed at least a couple of races.

The German-language Speed Week reports that the new Grands Prix scheduled for New Jersey and Mexico will in fact not take place next season.

The 2014 schedule should then shrink from an unprecedented 22 to a still-hectic 20 races.

Formula One chief executive Bernie Ecclestone was quoted as saying the construction of a new pit building in Mexico is "virtually impossible" for a November 2014 race date.

And New Jersey, he added, is "not going to happen because they haven't got their finances in place."

Ecclestone is quoted by SID news agency in Abu Dhabi: "I only put it (New Jersey) on the calendar because they assured me again and again that everything will work out."