The place for respectful and reverent discussion of Reject drivers and teams, whether profiled or not as yet
by dr-baker 11 Sep 2017, 10:32
This is the article I kinda had in mind when I set about writing my Lola profile (albeit in French instead of English).

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by dr-baker 16 Jun 2018, 14:15
https://www.autosport.com/other/news/13 ... e-19352018

Martin Birrane, who took over the Lola concern from Eric Broadley in 1997, has died. RIP.

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by FM1 17 Oct 2018, 21:58
dr-baker wrote:This is the article I kinda had in mind when I set about writing my Lola profile (albeit in French instead of English).


Hey! Writer of this article here. First of, thank you so much for the share! I hope you liked it even with that rough translation :)
Recently, I properly translated this article in English, you can find the link right here: https://formulemoy1.com/en/2017/02/15/l ... la-1-team/ (I also translated another one, I talked about De Cesaris, if you are interested)

See you!
by dr-baker 18 Oct 2018, 13:21
FM1 wrote:
dr-baker wrote:This is the article I kinda had in mind when I set about writing my Lola profile (albeit in French instead of English).


Hey! Writer of this article here. First of, thank you so much for the share! I hope you liked it even with that rough translation :)
Recently, I properly translated this article in English, you can find the link right here: https://formulemoy1.com/en/2017/02/15/l ... la-1-team/ (I also translated another one, I talked about De Cesaris, if you are interested)

See you!

I actually studied French at university level so I can read both French and English fairly well. Thank you for writing your article, it was good.

And I still intend on fixing the links in the first post at some point, honest!
EDIT: I have just noticed that all the image links in the first post are actually all working, so no need to fix them..

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by dr-baker 14 Nov 2018, 15:08
A reddit history of the Lola fiasco: https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comme ... team_when/

Unraced F1 has a Lola video!: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVsaqZW3c90

And to add to midgrid's FP videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4PSKgQLu4U

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by CaptainGetz12 19 Nov 2018, 03:42
Not sure if this was touched on in the old article, but something has been bothering me about MasterCard Lola...

Looking at qualifying for the Australian Grand Prix, all of the Bridgestone-shod cars qualified considerably slower than the Goodyear cars. Only two Bridgestone cars qualified in the top 10 (Johnny Herbert and Olivier Panis), with the back half of the field almost completely made of Bridgestone users.

The Lolas also uses Bridgestones, but in the following grand prix in Brazil (the race where Lola already closed its F1 operation) Bridgestone addressed issues with its tires if Panis's 5th place and Hill's 10th were any indication.

This makes me wonder: Would the Lolas of qualified for the Brazilian GP if they kept going after race one? If the tire issues were a deciding factor it makes the move to scuttle the F1 team as premature. They probably still would of made the back row of the grid, but at least the car would be racing. Is there any credence to this theory?

Klon wrote:What did poor André do to you for him to be insulted like that?
by FortiWinks 19 Nov 2018, 04:57
CaptainGetz12 wrote:Not sure if this was touched on in the old article, but something has been bothering me about MasterCard Lola...

Looking at qualifying for the Australian Grand Prix, all of the Bridgestone-shod cars qualified considerably slower than the Goodyear cars. Only two Bridgestone cars qualified in the top 10 (Johnny Herbert and Olivier Panis), with the back half of the field almost completely made of Bridgestone users.

The Lolas also uses Bridgestones, but in the following grand prix in Brazil (the race where Lola already closed its F1 operation) Bridgestone addressed issues with its tires if Panis's 5th place and Hill's 10th were any indication.

This makes me wonder: Would the Lolas of qualified for the Brazilian GP if they kept going after race one? If the tire issues were a deciding factor it makes the move to scuttle the F1 team as premature. They probably still would of made the back row of the grid, but at least the car would be racing. Is there any credence to this theory?


Interesting theory, although you have to factor into account that the second car would still be driven by Rosset ;)

Knows two facts about ducks and both of them are wrong
by Butterfox 19 Nov 2018, 05:03
CaptainGetz12 wrote:Not sure if this was touched on in the old article, but something has been bothering me about MasterCard Lola...

Looking at qualifying for the Australian Grand Prix, all of the Bridgestone-shod cars qualified considerably slower than the Goodyear cars. Only two Bridgestone cars qualified in the top 10 (Johnny Herbert and Olivier Panis), with the back half of the field almost completely made of Bridgestone users.

The Lolas also uses Bridgestones, but in the following grand prix in Brazil (the race where Lola already closed its F1 operation) Bridgestone addressed issues with its tires if Panis's 5th place and Hill's 10th were any indication.

This makes me wonder: Would the Lolas of qualified for the Brazilian GP if they kept going after race one? If the tire issues were a deciding factor it makes the move to scuttle the F1 team as premature. They probably still would of made the back row of the grid, but at least the car would be racing. Is there any credence to this theory?

Not yet in Brazil, At Australia, the gap between Lola and arrows who were second last, was just too big. But maybe from the European season on they could be doing better in the Bridgestone-favoured tracks. But they would have needed a reliable sponsor to get that far. Let alone do some development on the car. Another problem was the sub-par driver quality.

I don't know what i want and i want it now!
by Gertrand Bachot 19 Nov 2018, 18:05
This wrote:
CaptainGetz12 wrote:Not sure if this was touched on in the old article, but something has been bothering me about MasterCard Lola...

Looking at qualifying for the Australian Grand Prix, all of the Bridgestone-shod cars qualified considerably slower than the Goodyear cars. Only two Bridgestone cars qualified in the top 10 (Johnny Herbert and Olivier Panis), with the back half of the field almost completely made of Bridgestone users.

The Lolas also uses Bridgestones, but in the following grand prix in Brazil (the race where Lola already closed its F1 operation) Bridgestone addressed issues with its tires if Panis's 5th place and Hill's 10th were any indication.

This makes me wonder: Would the Lolas of qualified for the Brazilian GP if they kept going after race one? If the tire issues were a deciding factor it makes the move to scuttle the F1 team as premature. They probably still would of made the back row of the grid, but at least the car would be racing. Is there any credence to this theory?

Not yet in Brazil, At Australia, the gap between Lola and arrows who were second last, was just too big. But maybe from the European season on they could be doing better in the Bridgestone-favoured tracks. But they would have needed a reliable sponsor to get that far. Let alone do some development on the car. Another problem was the sub-par driver quality.

Come on, I don't think Vincenzo Sospiri was that bad.
by Rob Dylan 19 Nov 2018, 21:16
Well, he was going to be considered bad when you realise that Ricardo Rosset was one of the two greatest idols for Michael Schumacher -- oh wait, point withdrawn... :deletraz:

Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.


Felipe Nasr - the least forgettable F1 driver!
by Butterfox 20 Nov 2018, 02:00
I'm not sure Sospiri was bad, but he defenitely lacked the experience to set-up the car. Coupled that to Rosset being Rosset.

I don't know what i want and i want it now!
by Rob Dylan 20 Nov 2018, 10:17
Michael Schumacher wrote:The only heroes I really had were in the karting days, seeing two guys one of which was Ayrton Senna and the other Vincenzo Sospiri. They were so special in their own way, dominating the karting world. It was just fascinating to watch them.
Feel free to strikethrough and replace at your own convenience :P

Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.


Felipe Nasr - the least forgettable F1 driver!
by dr-baker 01 Dec 2018, 18:18
I have recently obtained a copy of the December 1996 issue of MotorSport magazine, so I have updated the first post with my own scanned copies of the relevant articles, plus added a little bit as I found stuff on Bridgestone testing (relevant as Lola ran on Bridgestone). This also signifies my slow transition from Photobucket to Imgur for hosting these images - I am glad that the images have reappeared after a Photobucket-induced hiatus, but the image stamp is annoying...




MotorSport magazine, December 1996

This magazine ran a Lola feature in their December 1996 issue. I obtained a copy in late November 2018 to scan these articles, but on the magazine's website, they have archived the whole back catalogue from 1923 to 2013! So here are the links to the articles of interest:

What Lola Wants, Lola Has Had To Hold On For
Lola's Formula One Heritage, first page
Lola's Formula One Heritage, second page
A Honda in Lola's clothing

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How was Ricardo Rosset able to go four WHOLE seconds quicker in this Bridgestone test than in qualifying at a race meeting? Was he making repeated mistakes in qually? Were the weather conditions different? Was the track more rubbered in? Was he in a different, better chassis? Was the engine mapping different? Were the tyres just that much better?

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Some other teams announce their engine deals at a late date (11th November 1996). I cannot remember if it was normal practice then to announce engine deals for the following season so late? Was it to avoid promoting a different engine brand while continuing with their current engine partner during the contemporary season?

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This (below) is a useful chronological timeline of Lola's history in Formula 1 in the run-up to their works entry.

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It seems odd now, looking back at the works entry that carries Lola's name, that Lola actually has a race win under another entry's name!


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watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by dr-baker 26 Dec 2018, 09:46


Some interesting info about the testing of the Lola T95/30. I will add this to the first post in due course.

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by dr-baker 05 Feb 2019, 16:43
Turns out that Racing Point were trying to revive the Lola name for this season...

https://www.racefans.net/2019/02/04/for ... lola-name/

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by Butterfox 06 Feb 2019, 03:56
They really have no ideas do they? :facepalm:

I don't know what i want and i want it now!
by FortiWinks 06 Feb 2019, 07:21
I’ve heard Andrea Moda is available if Mr. Stroll so desires...

Knows two facts about ducks and both of them are wrong
by mario 06 Feb 2019, 20:20
CarloSpace wrote:
dr-baker wrote:Turns out that Racing Point were trying to revive the Lola name for this season...

https://www.racefans.net/2019/02/04/for ... lola-name/

Apparently Brabham name too: https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/141335/brabham-refused-efforts-to-revive-name-in-f1

At this rate, you're half expecting them to try and turn up under the name of Sauber...

Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
by AdrianBelmonte_ 06 Feb 2019, 21:12
FortiWinks wrote:I’ve heard Andrea Moda is available if Mr. Stroll so desires...


Good luck to Daddy Stroll on trying to negotiate with Mr. Sassetti (he's still alive?)

Life is also available btw (and easier to take i guess)

#FoxesFansHooligans

#HaasShouldBeSoLucky
by CarloSpace 06 Feb 2019, 21:15
It is the team formerly known as Spyker, formerly known as, Midland, formerly known as Jordan after all, so maybe revive the Jordan name? I wouldn't oppose that!
by Rob Dylan 08 Feb 2019, 23:18
Make it so.

Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.


Felipe Nasr - the least forgettable F1 driver!
by dr-baker 16 Dec 2019, 21:57


Don't think I have seen a photo of the Lola / Al Melling V10 engine before. I think I assumed that because it wasn't due to debut until later in the season, that it had not yet been completed by the early races of the season. But I suppose that they would need time to install the engine, dyno-test it, on-track test it, and then debut the engine, so it makes sense that it did exist in March 1997. Although this comment by Ian Phillips is fascinating for what could have been later in the year!:

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by dr-baker 09 Jan 2020, 22:01
I swear I will eventually upload all the images in the first post to Imgur at some point! In the meantime, here is some stuff in French from the French Autosport, weekly car magazine, Auto Hebdo. (Taken from issues 1074: season preview edition, and 1076: Australian Grand Prix edition).

I plan English translations as an ongoing project alongside transferring over to Imgur.

And sorry, they are not currently in any sort of order. This will also be amended in due course before being dumped into the first post.

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Lola have a designated test driver, which not every team does, even if Lola never end up making use of Montermini…

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Oh, there was actually a way for MasterCard users to actually sign up to this sponsorship model! Wonder how many people did? No mention of it in the British press that I trawled through (Autosport, F1 News, MotorSport magazine, as found in post 1 of this thread).

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Stewart were the butt of a few jokes in the '97 Australian GP paddock too, not just Lola!

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All the fastest times from each official practice session, in a nice, easy-to-read table.

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A quick look through this list shows that the drivers are listed by car number order, and that Rosset and Sosperi are fairly mid-grid in terms of weight, proving that they are neither ballast nor lacking in muscle bulk relative to other drivers.

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An image clearly taken prior to the race, as the Mastercard Lola can be seen behind Panis's Prost.

And the images for the Tweets in the previous posts:

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watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by dr-baker 15 Mar 2020, 20:58
Found a pretty good YouTube video about MasterCard Lola here: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=y0ONIb0vTnE

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by dr-baker 17 Mar 2020, 14:05
An Italian Italian Autosprint article about the Lola T95/30 on Facebook: https://m.facebook.com/MasterCardLolaF1 ... oser=false

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by dr-baker 17 May 2020, 17:11
On the 22nd March 2020, this thread had 66,666 views. It is (just before I typed this) up to 87,878 views. Over 21,000 views in less than two months. There's something about this thread that's popular...

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by dinizintheoven 17 May 2020, 21:21
dr-baker wrote:On the 22nd March 2020, this thread had 66,666 views. It is (just before I typed this) up to 87,878 views. Over 21,000 views in less than two months. There's something about this thread that's popular...


There can be only one explanation.

Douglas Adams wrote:The Shoe Event Horizon theory is summarized as such: as a society sinks into depression, the people of the society need to cheer themselves up by buying themselves gifts, often shoes. It is also linked to the fact that when you are depressed you look down at your shoes and decide they aren't good enough quality so buy more expensive replacements. As more money is spent on shoes, more shoe shops are built, and the quality of the shoes begins to diminish as the demand for different types of shoes increases. This makes people buy more shoes.


That, of course, was 1980. And 40 years later, we have the internet. Instead of Footwarriors, we have bots. And instead of Hig Hurtenflurst, we have...

ALAN.

He's back, and he's brought an entire army.

James Allen, on his favourite F1 engine of all time:
"...the Life W12, I can't describe the noise to you, but imagine filling your dustbin with nuts and bolts, and then throwing it down the stairs, it was something akin to that!"
by dr-baker 17 May 2020, 22:58
Does Alan's Army consist primarily of the Andrea Moda team? Or is it just Alan's Shoe Spammers Traders?

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by dinizintheoven 18 May 2020, 08:04
Can't possibly be the Andrea Moda team, they're still stuck on the A89 just outside Lyon, behind some truckers standing around a brazier pretending it's a giant pack of Gauloises.

James Allen, on his favourite F1 engine of all time:
"...the Life W12, I can't describe the noise to you, but imagine filling your dustbin with nuts and bolts, and then throwing it down the stairs, it was something akin to that!"
by dr-baker 18 Feb 2021, 22:00
This is a brilliant podcast with more information/anecdotes that the first post in this thread doesn't cover, and has a brief interview with Allan McNish and others involved in the project. Well worth 75 minutes of your time.





Lola's brief attempt at joining the F1 grid in 1997 is one of the most famous failures in recent F1 history. In this episode of Bring Back V10s, Sam Smith and Edd Straw join Glenn Freeman to revisit how this famous British car constructor got things so badly wrong when it finally tried to enter its own team.

We look back at Lola's long-running ambition to enter F1 itself after building cars for other teams in the past, and why it kept stretching its own deadline for an entry for 1997. It's well known that title sponsor MasterCard forced the team to enter at the last minute - but why was the credit card company so insistent that it had to be '97 rather than Lola's preferred path to an entry in '98? There's also the stories of why the car was so bad, what it felt like to drive, why Lola thought it could design its own V10 engine on a fraction of the budget spent by major manufacturers, what happened when the T97/30 was finally put in a windtunnel, the drastic changes Lola considered making during the embarrassing Australian GP weekend, and how alterations were made for the second race of the year that would have made the car even slower if the team hadn't closed just before that Brazilian GP weekend.

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by Pacific Edge 25 Mar 2021, 11:45
Was refreshing to see companies like Mastercard and Pennzoil in F1, pity this experience may have scared them off F1 for good. Although with Mastercard, it was a considerable own goal
by dr-baker 25 Mar 2021, 18:43
Actually, MasterCard continued on in F1 for a few years afterwards. According to the podcast I linked to above by The Race, at the 1997 Brazilian GP, the folk from MasterCard were already at the race when Lola went under, so Jordan invited them to their hospitality for the weekend and ended up with a more traditional sponsorship deal. The MasterCard logos can be seen thereafter on either the top of the rollhoop or between the front suspension and the side pods.

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by dr-baker 01 May 2021, 18:09
I never expected this thread to get to 100,000 views...

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by CoopsII 04 May 2021, 06:37
dr-baker wrote:I never expected this thread to get to 100,000 views...

Bots be bots ;)

Just For One Day...
by dr-baker 04 May 2021, 13:49
CoopsII wrote:
dr-baker wrote:I never expected this thread to get to 100,000 views...

Bots be bots ;)

What's BOTtas got to do with it? ;)

watka wrote:I find it amusing that whilst you're one of the more openly Christian guys here, you are still first and foremost associated with an eye for the ladies!
dinizintheoven wrote:GOOD CHRISTIANS do not go to jail. EVERYONE ON FORMULA ONE REJECTS should be in jail.
MCard LOLA
by CoopsII 13 May 2021, 10:31
Number Two Demotion.......to Williams.....

Just For One Day...
by mario 13 May 2021, 21:37
Pacific Edge wrote:Was refreshing to see companies like Mastercard and Pennzoil in F1, pity this experience may have scared them off F1 for good. Although with Mastercard, it was a considerable own goal

Pennzoil did come back in later years as a minor sponsor of Haas...

Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
by tBone 14 May 2021, 07:46
mario wrote:
Pacific Edge wrote:Was refreshing to see companies like Mastercard and Pennzoil in F1, pity this experience may have scared them off F1 for good. Although with Mastercard, it was a considerable own goal

Pennzoil did come back in later years as a minor sponsor of Haas...

Did they though? Or was that only a rumor that never materialized?

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